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<blockquote data-quote="DEFCON 1" data-source="post: 6513524" data-attributes="member: 7006">No... I'd say the perennial problem has always been experienced players thinking new players need way more hand-holding than they do.&nbsp; They've always condescendingly treated the &quot;newbie&quot; as though they were a Faberge egg that was going to shatter at the slightest provocation.&nbsp; Everything's always &quot;Have to help the newbie!&nbsp; Have to make it so simple for the newbie otherwise they'll quit!&quot;&nbsp; When in point of fact... I don't think they're nearly that fragile and have to be &quot;protected&quot;.A new group can pick up the Starter Set and play the five levels of Lost Mines.&nbsp; After that, if they decide they like D&amp;D and want to keep playing... the DM checks out dnd.wizards.com for more information, downloads the Basic Rules, and then either decides to pick up HotDQ and play that, or else chooses to make up some new encounters themself for the players using the monsters from the Basic Rules.&nbsp; And then if they go all-in one or more of them decide to buy the Holy Trinity.I fail to see why there's anything in this that is going to confuse those players or drive them away that a gazeteer wouldn't suddenly &quot;fix&quot;.&nbsp; Especially considering that if they *truly are* new players... they have had no experience in having more product available to look through.&nbsp; So you can't come to the conclusion that something is missing if you've never experienced having it in the first place.</blockquote>

[QUOTE="DEFCON 1, post: 6513524, member: 7006"] No... I'd say the perennial problem has always been experienced players thinking new players need way more hand-holding than they do. They've always condescendingly treated the "newbie" as though they were a Faberge egg that was going to shatter at the slightest provocation. Everything's always "Have to help the newbie! Have to make it so simple for the newbie otherwise they'll quit!" When in point of fact... I don't think they're nearly that fragile and have to be "protected". A new group can pick up the Starter Set and play the five levels of Lost Mines. After that, if they decide they like D&D and want to keep playing... the DM checks out dnd.wizards.com for more information, downloads the Basic Rules, and then either decides to pick up HotDQ and play that, or else chooses to make up some new encounters themself for the players using the monsters from the Basic Rules. And then if they go all-in one or more of them decide to buy the Holy Trinity. I fail to see why there's anything in this that is going to confuse those players or drive them away that a gazeteer wouldn't suddenly "fix". Especially considering that if they *truly are* new players... they have had no experience in having [b]more[/b] product available to look through. So you can't come to the conclusion that something is missing if you've never experienced having it in the first place. [/QUOTE]

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