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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Chaosmancer" data-source="post: 8002259" data-attributes="member: 6801228">Great. Tell me how you use sorcerery points to cast metamagic and that does not limit the number of spell slots they can use sorcerery points to create? Without eating their other spell slots? If you can deny it, then deny it.So, he novas all his points, and has to remove his spells per day to get more of them. A wizard uses his class abilities (this does not cut into their spells), a wizard uses their arcane recvery (this does not cut into their class abilities)Yes, a wizard can't use the sorcerers unique mechanic, and they can't make a spell slot right now but over the course of a full day, they have more spells. Especially if the sorcerer tries to act like a sorcerer.It is not the same. It cannot be.Unless you can explain to me how casting a second level spell makes the wizard lose three first level spells. Or how casting a second level spell uses up a diviner's portent ability. Then it would be the same.Am not saying portent is a bad ability am I? Am I claiming Battlemaster maneuvers are bad? No. Because those abilities cost are limited within their abilities. If you use portent, then portent is used up. That makes sense. If you use metamagic, then you use up metamagic, and you can't create as many spells, and you might even have to eat your other spells. Metamagic never feels like enough for all the restrictions placed on sorcerers. It shouldn't be at-will, that is clearly too powerful. But that also doesn't mean that things are good as they are.Why do you think I am claiming they are stupid? Or that they have lost IQ? Do you think only stupid people misjudge their resources? Have players never reacted to an enemy trick and misused resourcesMaybe they Twinned a polymorph and then next round the wizard player pulled out a wand of fireballs they had and nuked the encounter, so the twin polymorph wasn't needed.Ah right, I had forgotten that they used the same chart. My mistake.Ah, you only listed the metamagics that cost 1 point. Ignoring Quicken then, one of the best metamagics generally. But, even you seem to mention it would be useless crap, so, you have the ability to do something that isn't worth doing. It is an option that no one would even use. It would be like saying the wizard has the option to burn their spellbook. Sure, they have that option. No one wants to do that, because it doesn't help them, so why is it an option we care to talk about?What is the defining feature of the Sorcerer? What is the one ability they have that no other class has? Is it the ability to cast more spells. Or is it metamagic, the feature that an entire new system was created just for them to use, that takes up the majority of their design space and restricted their spells known? Sure they can adapt, but metamagic is their defining feature. It is like the rogue's sneak attack, the paladin's smite, or the bard's inspiration.So, a wizard has to use their ability before they can benefit from it. The sorcerer using their ability can cut off access to their other ability.Because, and hold onto something, if they replenish their spells, they might not have the points to use metamagic. And if they use metamagic, they might not have the points to replenish their spells. Trying to do both, just makes both less effective</blockquote>

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