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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Khaalis" data-source="post: 1386565" data-attributes="member: 2167">Just a few quick comments that may not make much sense but I'll try. I'll reply more later (its the middle of the night for me but I cant sleep).1) What happened to the Genericisism everyone seemed to want and push for? Rellying 100% on lineage removes that option and the core build concept of KISS and we are back to a TOO mutable and PrC oriented 20 level class. Lineage CAN be part of the core build using the argument of the flavor text, but it should not be mandatory - thus the "Generic" option. There still needs to be that generic option just as there is for the cleric.2) Why 1,3,6,13,17,20?  Thats level gaps of 2,3,7,4,3 - why such a vastly differing spread? Why the 7 level leap? 3) With the proposed Metamagic as the only class ability - I still dont see an incentive to stay a Sorcerer past the minimum level to get to a PrC (and Grayhawk you seem to be the first person I have ever see post that states that they DONT use PrCs), and we cant base a "core build" concept on ignoring the options open to players. As I have stated, the class should not be designed to allow easy access to PrC but it needs to be acknowledged that they exist and that people will take them. The point is to make the class balanced enough to disuade people from WANTING to PrC out ASAP because anything is better tha the core (as it is now).Personally I wouldnt play the option listed with just Metamagic, though granted it does have an extra spell known per level. In fact I would rather revert to choosing Monte's Sorcerer over that build but again only until I could PrC or Multiclass out. Granted that just my opinion, but if I wanted to purely about metamagic - I'd be a wizard.4) So far due to majority rule... BAB, Saves, Skills, HD, & Weapons/Armor are set as listed for this build. The primary discussion now is the class abilities.5) I think I want to keep the spell-like "evolution" as an iterating ability, and work around that with other abilities. I disagree on familiars being approprate for Sorcerers, but that is my opinion, though I know many agree. I will be including them as part of a lineage (though they can always be attained by feat if someone so chooses).6) Arcane Sense: Would this be "less Powerful" (which I dont see, it IS only a cantrip...) if it were a spell-like ability usable a number of times per day based on Charisma? What if it had a permanency cost such as permanently giving up 1 or 2 0-level castable spell per day?7) As for all lineage abilities being matamagical in orientation: It cant happen unless they all start to look the same which is rather self-defeating. More often than not they will need to be spell-like or supernatural in nature to reflect the influence of the lineage. Otherwise why bother with various lineages if they all get say "Gain a +1 save to X type of spell" at 3rd and at say 6th "All spells of X type may be effected by Y effect, Z times per day".8) Am I doing this in vein? I am seeing more people posting that disagree with the Core Analysis and Mission Statement forr this thread.  If thats so - why bother re-writing it then? Or if you disagree with the mission of the thread why bother posting to disway those that do believe it needs re-written?  <img src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/joypixels/assets/8.0/png/unicode/64/1f615.png" class="smilie smilie--emoji" loading="lazy" width="64" height="64" alt=":confused:" title="Confused    :confused:"  data-smilie="5"data-shortname=":confused:" /> See <a href="http://www.enworld.org/forums/showt...28&goto=newpost" target="_blank">http://www.enworld.org/forums/showt...28&goto=newpost</a> instead.Ok thats all my brain can handle for now - hope it makes some kind of sense. I'm back off to bed again and will reply more tonight.</blockquote>

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