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<blockquote data-quote="Lion" data-source="post: 5041384" data-attributes="member: 87046">(Thank you to those who responded previously and sorry to those who knew it shouldn't be in the general RPG area. I was a bit confused by the fact that this list has a sub-title that says if it is a 4e question of a general nature to place it in the general RPG section. I did not think about the fact that someone might respond with rules, and my question contains nothing specific about rules so I didn't think it belonged in here. Now back to the discussion.)The group I have been playing with since 4e came out has been mostly stuck in combat and we are trying to find ways to speed up combat, because our game time is limited to about six &amp; a half hours a month. We have had one session where we role played and had one combat and it was great fun and just what we were hoping to get from the game. All the other times we have met there has been a minimal amount of role playing and a huge amount of rolling dice. We have been talking about how to increase speed and prevent the combat from dragging out. We do not want to cut out combat altogether or make it so simple that it is worthless to add, but we do want it to be over more quickly.A couple of the ideas tossed out on the table were:1. know your character (I know, duh, but it was said and there is a reason it was said also.)2. sit at the table &amp; pay attention (I know another, duh, but it was also said and there is a reason.)3. Use a chess clock and limit the amount of time the player gets to tell the DM what they are going to do.a. if time runs out the player is skipped or...b. if time runs out the player uses a melee basic attack or a ranged basic attack which ever makes more sense at that time for that character or...c. if time runs out the player will have named a default at-will power at the beginning of the night or when the character was created and that is the action they get to use.&nbsp;&nbsp;Any other ideas that are being used currently, and has anyone else run in to this issue of not being able to do both role play &amp; roll play?&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; <img src="http://www.enworld.org/forum/images/enw/statusicon/user_offline.gif" alt="" class="fr-fic fr-dii fr-draggable " data-size="" style="" />&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; <img src="http://www.enworld.org/forum/images/enw/statusicon/post_old.gif" alt="" class="fr-fic fr-dii fr-draggable " data-size="" style="" />&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; 27th December 2009, 12:29 AM&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; #<a href="http://www.enworld.org/forum/5038975-post2.html" target="_blank">2</a> (<a href="http://www.enworld.org/forum/general-rpg-rules-discussion/269793-speeding-up-combat-4th-edition-d-d.html#post5038975" target="_blank">permalink</a>)&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; <a href="http://www.enworld.org/forum/members/garmorn.html" target="_blank">Garmorn</a> &nbsp;Registered User&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; <a href="http://www.enworld.org/forum/members/garmorn.html" target="_blank"><img src="http://www.enworld.org/forum/images/avatars/tn_88161_620_44.jpg" alt="" class="fr-fic fr-dii fr-draggable " data-size="" style="" /></a> &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; &nbsp;Join Date: Jan 2002&nbsp;Location: Austin&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Posts: 590&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; &nbsp; <img src="http://www.enworld.org/forum/images/reputation/reputation_pos.gif" alt="" class="fr-fic fr-dii fr-draggable " data-size="" style="" />&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; &nbsp; Role both attack and damage at the same time.&nbsp;Use power cards and have them laid down on the table before a player's turn. Have them face down until the players turn that way others are not influenced by them if you want. &nbsp;Have a easy fast way to track initiative. Cards or a program for example that allows quick changes in order.&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; __________________&nbsp;Garmorn&nbsp;Seeking Players in Austin TX:&nbsp;<a href="http://www.enworld.org/forum/gamers-seeking-gamers/269004-south-austin.html#post5020173" target="_blank">http://www.enworld.org/forum/gamers-...ml#post5020173</a>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;<a href="http://quizfarm.com/quizzes/Fashion/ellydragon/laws-game-style/" target="_blank">Law's Game Style Quiz</a>Storyteller 33%Method Actor 67%Specialist 42%Power Gamer 42%Tactician 75%Butt-Kicker 50%Casual Gamer 50% &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; <img src="http://www.enworld.org/forum/images/enw/statusicon/user_offline.gif" alt="" class="fr-fic fr-dii fr-draggable " data-size="" style="" />&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; <img src="http://www.enworld.org/forum/images/enw/statusicon/post_old.gif" alt="" class="fr-fic fr-dii fr-draggable " data-size="" style="" />&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; 27th December 2009, 05:29 AM&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; #<a href="http://www.enworld.org/forum/5039106-post3.html" target="_blank">3</a> (<a href="http://www.enworld.org/forum/general-rpg-rules-discussion/269793-speeding-up-combat-4th-edition-d-d.html#post5039106" target="_blank">permalink</a>)&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; <a href="http://www.enworld.org/forum/members/dragonblade.html" target="_blank">Dragonblade</a> &nbsp;Registered User&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; <a href="http://www.enworld.org/forum/members/dragonblade.html" target="_blank"><img src="http://www.enworld.org/forum/images/avatars/ring7.jpg" alt="" class="fr-fic fr-dii fr-draggable " data-size="" style="" /></a> &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; &nbsp;Join Date: Feb 2002&nbsp;Location: Portland, OR&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Posts: 2,120&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; &nbsp; <img src="http://www.enworld.org/forum/images/reputation/reputation_pos.gif" alt="" class="fr-fic fr-dii fr-draggable " data-size="" style="" />&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; &nbsp; I run a weeknight game that last about 3.5 hours because my players all have to work the next day. We get through 2 to 3 combats a night and still have plenty of RP time. We play by the book, no house rules to change monster HPs and we run only published WotC adventures. We are in the middle of Pyramid of Shadows right now.&nbsp;Really, it does come down to the players knowing their characters and not wasting time. There is no excuse for any one player's turn taking more than 20-30 seconds. And even that is slow. Myself and two of my players also were on a team that beat the WotC Ultimate Dungeon Delve at PAX. We are good enough to take our turns in under 10 seconds if we cut out the table chit chat and really focus.&nbsp;When we first starting practicing for the Delve, we were really slow and we would always hem and haw over our turn. Should I use this power or that power. But training for the Delve really taught us to focus and we have carried over that focus into our regular game nights.&nbsp;You have a standard, move, minor. So it shouldnt take too long to decide how to use those actions on your turn. If you attack, roll your attack and damage at the same time. Your modifiers should already be calculated, just roll dice and add numbers. Have a calculator handy if you don't like adding in your head. If your allies have used powers that give you some kind of bonus, or if a monster has inflicted a penalty on you, you should make note on some scratch paper or your character sheet so that by the time your turn comes around you already know what you need to do.&nbsp;If you use the WotC Character Builder all your powers and mods should already be calculated for you. The one guy in our group who does not use the Builder has pre-written all his mods on a separate paper for every power he has as well. We never need to crack open a book during play to look up powers or abilities.&nbsp;Since the DM is often the speed bottleneck due to being the one trying to run multiple monsters at once, it can sometimes help to designate one of the players to be an assistant that tracks initiative order and/or monster conditions during the combat. That can free up the DM to focus solely on how the monsters move and attack.&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; __________________&nbsp;Check out <a href="http://www.dragonavenue.com/" target="_blank">Dragonavenue.com!</a> &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; <img src="http://www.enworld.org/forum/images/enw/statusicon/user_offline.gif" alt="" class="fr-fic fr-dii fr-draggable " data-size="" style="" />&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; <img src="http://www.enworld.org/forum/images/enw/statusicon/post_old.gif" alt="" class="fr-fic fr-dii fr-draggable " data-size="" style="" />&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; 27th December 2009, 05:37 AM&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; #<a href="http://www.enworld.org/forum/5039111-post4.html" target="_blank">4</a> (<a href="http://www.enworld.org/forum/general-rpg-rules-discussion/269793-speeding-up-combat-4th-edition-d-d.html#post5039111" target="_blank">permalink</a>)&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; <a href="http://www.enworld.org/forum/members/dragonblade.html" target="_blank">Dragonblade</a> &nbsp;Registered User&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; <a href="http://www.enworld.org/forum/members/dragonblade.html" target="_blank"><img src="http://www.enworld.org/forum/images/avatars/ring7.jpg" alt="" class="fr-fic fr-dii fr-draggable " data-size="" style="" /></a> &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; &nbsp;Join Date: Feb 2002&nbsp;Location: Portland, OR&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Posts: 2,120&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; &nbsp; <img src="http://www.enworld.org/forum/images/reputation/reputation_pos.gif" alt="" class="fr-fic fr-dii fr-draggable " data-size="" style="" />&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; &nbsp; One other tip is avoid unnecessary grind. If the combat has come down to only one or two monsters left and you can tell the players are going to win, don't waste time going through the motions. Unless one of the monsters has a nasty power that can take out a player or is a solo or elite, just let the next successful hit take them out and move on with the adventure.&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; __________________&nbsp;Check out <a href="http://www.dragonavenue.com/" target="_blank">Dragonavenue.com!</a> &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; <img src="http://www.enworld.org/forum/images/enw/statusicon/user_offline.gif" alt="" class="fr-fic fr-dii fr-draggable " data-size="" style="" />&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; <img src="http://www.enworld.org/forum/images/enw/statusicon/post_old.gif" alt="" class="fr-fic fr-dii fr-draggable " data-size="" style="" />&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; 27th December 2009, 02:07 PM&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; #<a href="http://www.enworld.org/forum/5039198-post5.html" target="_blank">5</a> (<a href="http://www.enworld.org/forum/general-rpg-rules-discussion/269793-speeding-up-combat-4th-edition-d-d.html#post5039198" target="_blank">permalink</a>)&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; <a href="http://www.enworld.org/forum/members/defendi.html" target="_blank">defendi</a> &nbsp;Registered User&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; &nbsp;Join Date: Jul 2007&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Posts: 150&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; &nbsp; <img src="http://www.enworld.org/forum/images/reputation/reputation_pos.gif" alt="" class="fr-fic fr-dii fr-draggable " data-size="" style="" />&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; &nbsp; We dropped our combats to about 1/4 the time after a particularly bad battle (2.5 hours). All we did was have every player commit to know what they are going to do and making their turn in less than a minute. Now we have very relaxed, comfortable combats that last 40-50 minutes.&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; __________________<img src="http://www.wizards.com/dnd/class/images/banners/Paladin.jpg" alt="" class="fr-fic fr-dii fr-draggable " data-size="" style="" />
 <a href="http://www.wizards.com/dnd/" target="_blank">D&amp;D Home Page</a> - <a href="http://www.wizards.com/dnd/class/index.asp" target="_blank">What Class Are You?</a> - <a href="http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/insider/characterbuilder" target="_blank">Build A Character</a> - <a href="http://www.wizards.com/dndinsider/compendium/database.aspx?searchterm=Paladin" target="_blank">D&amp;D Compendium</a>&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; <img src="http://www.enworld.org/forum/images/enw/statusicon/user_offline.gif" alt="" class="fr-fic fr-dii fr-draggable " data-size="" style="" />&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; <img src="http://www.enworld.org/forum/images/enw/statusicon/post_old.gif" alt="" class="fr-fic fr-dii fr-draggable " data-size="" style="" />&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; 28th December 2009, 09:20 PM&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; #<a href="http://www.enworld.org/forum/5040029-post6.html" target="_blank">6</a> (<a href="http://www.enworld.org/forum/general-rpg-rules-discussion/269793-speeding-up-combat-4th-edition-d-d.html#post5040029" target="_blank">permalink</a>)&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; <a href="http://www.enworld.org/forum/members/stacie-gmrgrl.html" target="_blank">Stacie GmrGrl</a> &nbsp;Registered User&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; <a href="http://www.enworld.org/forum/members/stacie-gmrgrl.html" target="_blank"><img src="http://www.enworld.org/forum/avatars/stacie-gmrgrl.gif?dateline=1262030224" alt="" class="fr-fic fr-dii fr-draggable " data-size="" style="" /></a> &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; &nbsp;Join Date: Nov 2009&nbsp;Location: salem, oregon&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Posts: 3&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; &nbsp; <img src="http://www.enworld.org/forum/images/reputation/reputation_balance.gif" alt="" class="fr-fic fr-dii fr-draggable " data-size="" style="" />&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; &nbsp; Idk, but once we took Savage Worlds initiative system and it really sped up play...basically we used a deck of cards, each person was dealt a card face up, the person with Improved initiative got two bonus cards and got to choose or something like that. We thought about setting it where a person got a card per +2 bonus of the initiative modifier and got to choose, but we never got around to trying it.&nbsp;Then we knew who was going when, and it also gave it a random element that each round it would be a little different and it was fast.&nbsp;DM houseruled that we had 30 seconds to make our decisions as well, or else we were flat footed by indecision. He had a stop watch.&nbsp;It was amazing fun.&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; __________________&nbsp;Member of the <a href="http://http//groups.google.com/group/cult-of-ore" target="_blank">Cult of ORE</a> and <a href="http://http//groups.google.com/group/fightrpg" target="_blank">Fight! The Fighting Game RPG</a> google groups - One Roll Engine gaming awesomeness and a rpg that really looks like it will do fighting games well. &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; <img src="http://www.enworld.org/forum/images/enw/statusicon/user_offline.gif" alt="" class="fr-fic fr-dii fr-draggable " data-size="" style="" />&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; <img src="http://www.enworld.org/forum/images/enw/statusicon/post_old.gif" alt="" class="fr-fic fr-dii fr-draggable " data-size="" style="" />&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; 28th December 2009, 09:46 PM&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; #<a href="http://www.enworld.org/forum/5040058-post7.html" target="_blank">7</a> (<a href="http://www.enworld.org/forum/general-rpg-rules-discussion/269793-speeding-up-combat-4th-edition-d-d.html#post5040058" target="_blank">permalink</a>)&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; <a href="http://www.enworld.org/forum/members/infiniti2000.html" target="_blank">Infiniti2000</a> &nbsp;Evil Hatrack&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; <a href="http://www.enworld.org/forum/members/infiniti2000.html" target="_blank"><img src="http://www.enworld.org/forum/avatars/infiniti2000.gif?dateline=1115390167" alt="" class="fr-fic fr-dii fr-draggable " data-size="" style="" /></a> &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; &nbsp;Join Date: May 2005&nbsp;Location: Orlando, Florida&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; Posts: 9,702&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; &nbsp; <img src="http://www.enworld.org/forum/images/reputation/reputation_pos.gif" alt="" class="fr-fic fr-dii fr-draggable " data-size="" style="" />&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp;&nbsp; &nbsp; I echo the &quot;not wasting time&quot; sentiment.&nbsp; 4E is far more tolerant of bad combat decisions, so no longer is it really vital for the PCs to take 5 minutes to choose the perfect spell or action. Know your character enough to be able to decide if one of his special abilities will work well or simply go with a basic attack or default at-will. The idea of imposing a time limit is generally met with abhorrence by most players, but a gentle reminder that the perfect tactic not only doesn't exist, but is not likely to win the day will help appease such players.&nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; &nbsp; __________________Hva' fanden? Får vi en orkan?</blockquote>

[QUOTE="Lion, post: 5041384, member: 87046"] [SIZE=1][I](Thank you to those who responded previously and sorry to those who knew it shouldn't be in the general RPG area. I was a bit confused by the fact that this list has a sub-title that says if it is a 4e question of a general nature to place it in the general RPG section. I did not think about the fact that someone might respond with rules, and my question contains nothing specific about rules so I didn't think it belonged in here. Now back to the discussion.)[/I][/SIZE] The group I have been playing with since 4e came out has been mostly stuck in combat and we are trying to find ways to speed up combat, because our game time is limited to about six & a half hours a month. We have had one session where we role played and had one combat and it was great fun and just what we were hoping to get from the game. All the other times we have met there has been a minimal amount of role playing and a huge amount of rolling dice. We have been talking about how to increase speed and prevent the combat from dragging out. We do not want to cut out combat altogether or make it so simple that it is worthless to add, but we do want it to be over more quickly. A couple of the ideas tossed out on the table were: 1. know your character (I know, duh, but it was said and there is a reason it was said also.) 2. sit at the table & pay attention (I know another, duh, but it was also said and there is a reason.) 3. Use a chess clock and limit the amount of time the player gets to tell the DM what they are going to do. a. if time runs out the player is skipped or... b. if time runs out the player uses a melee basic attack or a ranged basic attack which ever makes more sense at that time for that character or... c. if time runs out the player will have named a default at-will power at the beginning of the night or when the character was created and that is the action they get to use. [B][COLOR=DarkRed]Any other ideas that are being used currently, and has anyone else run in to this issue of not being able to do both role play & roll play?[/COLOR][/B] [IMG]http://www.enworld.org/forum/images/enw/statusicon/user_offline.gif[/IMG] [IMG]http://www.enworld.org/forum/images/enw/statusicon/post_old.gif[/IMG] 27th December 2009, 12:29 AM #[URL="http://www.enworld.org/forum/5038975-post2.html"][B]2[/B][/URL] ([B][URL="http://www.enworld.org/forum/general-rpg-rules-discussion/269793-speeding-up-combat-4th-edition-d-d.html#post5038975"]permalink[/URL][/B]) [URL="http://www.enworld.org/forum/members/garmorn.html"]Garmorn[/URL] Registered User [URL="http://www.enworld.org/forum/members/garmorn.html"][IMG]http://www.enworld.org/forum/images/avatars/tn_88161_620_44.jpg[/IMG][/URL] Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: Austin Posts: 590 [IMG]http://www.enworld.org/forum/images/reputation/reputation_pos.gif[/IMG] Role both attack and damage at the same time. Use power cards and have them laid down on the table before a player's turn. Have them face down until the players turn that way others are not influenced by them if you want. Have a easy fast way to track initiative. Cards or a program for example that allows quick changes in order. __________________ Garmorn Seeking Players in Austin TX: [URL="http://www.enworld.org/forum/gamers-seeking-gamers/269004-south-austin.html#post5020173"]http://www.enworld.org/forum/gamers-...ml#post5020173[/URL] [URL="http://quizfarm.com/quizzes/Fashion/ellydragon/laws-game-style/"]Law's Game Style Quiz[/URL] Storyteller 33% Method Actor 67% Specialist 42% Power Gamer 42% Tactician 75% Butt-Kicker 50% Casual Gamer 50% [IMG]http://www.enworld.org/forum/images/enw/statusicon/user_offline.gif[/IMG] [IMG]http://www.enworld.org/forum/images/enw/statusicon/post_old.gif[/IMG] 27th December 2009, 05:29 AM #[URL="http://www.enworld.org/forum/5039106-post3.html"][B]3[/B][/URL] ([B][URL="http://www.enworld.org/forum/general-rpg-rules-discussion/269793-speeding-up-combat-4th-edition-d-d.html#post5039106"]permalink[/URL][/B]) [URL="http://www.enworld.org/forum/members/dragonblade.html"]Dragonblade[/URL] Registered User [URL="http://www.enworld.org/forum/members/dragonblade.html"][IMG]http://www.enworld.org/forum/images/avatars/ring7.jpg[/IMG][/URL] Join Date: Feb 2002 Location: Portland, OR Posts: 2,120 [IMG]http://www.enworld.org/forum/images/reputation/reputation_pos.gif[/IMG] I run a weeknight game that last about 3.5 hours because my players all have to work the next day. We get through 2 to 3 combats a night and still have plenty of RP time. We play by the book, no house rules to change monster HPs and we run only published WotC adventures. We are in the middle of Pyramid of Shadows right now. Really, it does come down to the players knowing their characters and not wasting time. There is no excuse for any one player's turn taking more than 20-30 seconds. And even that is slow. Myself and two of my players also were on a team that beat the WotC Ultimate Dungeon Delve at PAX. We are good enough to take our turns in under 10 seconds if we cut out the table chit chat and really focus. When we first starting practicing for the Delve, we were really slow and we would always hem and haw over our turn. Should I use this power or that power. But training for the Delve really taught us to focus and we have carried over that focus into our regular game nights. You have a standard, move, minor. So it shouldnt take too long to decide how to use those actions on your turn. If you attack, roll your attack and damage at the same time. Your modifiers should already be calculated, just roll dice and add numbers. Have a calculator handy if you don't like adding in your head. If your allies have used powers that give you some kind of bonus, or if a monster has inflicted a penalty on you, you should make note on some scratch paper or your character sheet so that by the time your turn comes around you already know what you need to do. If you use the WotC Character Builder all your powers and mods should already be calculated for you. The one guy in our group who does not use the Builder has pre-written all his mods on a separate paper for every power he has as well. We never need to crack open a book during play to look up powers or abilities. Since the DM is often the speed bottleneck due to being the one trying to run multiple monsters at once, it can sometimes help to designate one of the players to be an assistant that tracks initiative order and/or monster conditions during the combat. That can free up the DM to focus solely on how the monsters move and attack. __________________ Check out [URL="http://www.dragonavenue.com/"]Dragonavenue.com![/URL] [IMG]http://www.enworld.org/forum/images/enw/statusicon/user_offline.gif[/IMG] [IMG]http://www.enworld.org/forum/images/enw/statusicon/post_old.gif[/IMG] 27th December 2009, 05:37 AM #[URL="http://www.enworld.org/forum/5039111-post4.html"][B]4[/B][/URL] ([B][URL="http://www.enworld.org/forum/general-rpg-rules-discussion/269793-speeding-up-combat-4th-edition-d-d.html#post5039111"]permalink[/URL][/B]) [URL="http://www.enworld.org/forum/members/dragonblade.html"]Dragonblade[/URL] Registered User [URL="http://www.enworld.org/forum/members/dragonblade.html"][IMG]http://www.enworld.org/forum/images/avatars/ring7.jpg[/IMG][/URL] Join Date: Feb 2002 Location: Portland, OR Posts: 2,120 [IMG]http://www.enworld.org/forum/images/reputation/reputation_pos.gif[/IMG] One other tip is avoid unnecessary grind. If the combat has come down to only one or two monsters left and you can tell the players are going to win, don't waste time going through the motions. Unless one of the monsters has a nasty power that can take out a player or is a solo or elite, just let the next successful hit take them out and move on with the adventure. __________________ Check out [URL="http://www.dragonavenue.com/"]Dragonavenue.com![/URL] [IMG]http://www.enworld.org/forum/images/enw/statusicon/user_offline.gif[/IMG] [IMG]http://www.enworld.org/forum/images/enw/statusicon/post_old.gif[/IMG] 27th December 2009, 02:07 PM #[URL="http://www.enworld.org/forum/5039198-post5.html"][B]5[/B][/URL] ([B][URL="http://www.enworld.org/forum/general-rpg-rules-discussion/269793-speeding-up-combat-4th-edition-d-d.html#post5039198"]permalink[/URL][/B]) [URL="http://www.enworld.org/forum/members/defendi.html"]defendi[/URL] Registered User Join Date: Jul 2007 Posts: 150 [IMG]http://www.enworld.org/forum/images/reputation/reputation_pos.gif[/IMG] We dropped our combats to about 1/4 the time after a particularly bad battle (2.5 hours). All we did was have every player commit to know what they are going to do and making their turn in less than a minute. Now we have very relaxed, comfortable combats that last 40-50 minutes. __________________ [CENTER][IMG]http://www.wizards.com/dnd/class/images/banners/Paladin.jpg[/IMG] [URL="http://www.wizards.com/dnd/"]D&D Home Page[/URL] - [URL="http://www.wizards.com/dnd/class/index.asp"]What Class Are You?[/URL] - [URL="http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/insider/characterbuilder"]Build A Character[/URL] - [URL="http://www.wizards.com/dndinsider/compendium/database.aspx?searchterm=Paladin"]D&D Compendium[/URL][/CENTER] [IMG]http://www.enworld.org/forum/images/enw/statusicon/user_offline.gif[/IMG] [IMG]http://www.enworld.org/forum/images/enw/statusicon/post_old.gif[/IMG] 28th December 2009, 09:20 PM #[URL="http://www.enworld.org/forum/5040029-post6.html"][B]6[/B][/URL] ([B][URL="http://www.enworld.org/forum/general-rpg-rules-discussion/269793-speeding-up-combat-4th-edition-d-d.html#post5040029"]permalink[/URL][/B]) [URL="http://www.enworld.org/forum/members/stacie-gmrgrl.html"]Stacie GmrGrl[/URL] Registered User [URL="http://www.enworld.org/forum/members/stacie-gmrgrl.html"][IMG]http://www.enworld.org/forum/avatars/stacie-gmrgrl.gif?dateline=1262030224[/IMG][/URL] Join Date: Nov 2009 Location: salem, oregon Posts: 3 [IMG]http://www.enworld.org/forum/images/reputation/reputation_balance.gif[/IMG] Idk, but once we took Savage Worlds initiative system and it really sped up play...basically we used a deck of cards, each person was dealt a card face up, the person with Improved initiative got two bonus cards and got to choose or something like that. We thought about setting it where a person got a card per +2 bonus of the initiative modifier and got to choose, but we never got around to trying it. Then we knew who was going when, and it also gave it a random element that each round it would be a little different and it was fast. DM houseruled that we had 30 seconds to make our decisions as well, or else we were flat footed by indecision. He had a stop watch. It was amazing fun. __________________ Member of the [URL="http://http//groups.google.com/group/cult-of-ore"]Cult of ORE[/URL] and [URL="http://http//groups.google.com/group/fightrpg"]Fight! The Fighting Game RPG[/URL] google groups - One Roll Engine gaming awesomeness and a rpg that really looks like it will do fighting games well. [IMG]http://www.enworld.org/forum/images/enw/statusicon/user_offline.gif[/IMG] [IMG]http://www.enworld.org/forum/images/enw/statusicon/post_old.gif[/IMG] 28th December 2009, 09:46 PM #[URL="http://www.enworld.org/forum/5040058-post7.html"][B]7[/B][/URL] ([B][URL="http://www.enworld.org/forum/general-rpg-rules-discussion/269793-speeding-up-combat-4th-edition-d-d.html#post5040058"]permalink[/URL][/B]) [URL="http://www.enworld.org/forum/members/infiniti2000.html"]Infiniti2000[/URL] Evil Hatrack [URL="http://www.enworld.org/forum/members/infiniti2000.html"][IMG]http://www.enworld.org/forum/avatars/infiniti2000.gif?dateline=1115390167[/IMG][/URL] Join Date: May 2005 Location: Orlando, Florida Posts: 9,702 [IMG]http://www.enworld.org/forum/images/reputation/reputation_pos.gif[/IMG] I echo the "not wasting time" sentiment. 4E is far more tolerant of bad combat decisions, so no longer is it really vital for the PCs to take 5 minutes to choose the perfect spell or action. Know your character enough to be able to decide if one of his special abilities will work well or simply go with a basic attack or default at-will. The idea of imposing a time limit is generally met with abhorrence by most players, but a gentle reminder that the perfect tactic not only doesn't exist, but is not likely to win the day will help appease such players. __________________ [CENTER]Hva' fanden? Får vi en orkan?[/CENTER] [/QUOTE]

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