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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Elder-Basilisk" data-source="post: 397075" data-attributes="member: 3146">My goodness no! no! no! No character would ever make a save again in their careers. The Iconic wizard's save DC for a 1st level spell would be 41 by the time she reached 20th level. If she's permitted greater spell focus as well, that's DC 43. Let me see who could make that DC on their most favorable save--Clr 3/Pal3/Templar10/Hospitaller 4Base Fort Save +17Con bonus +4Charisma bonus +6Resistance bonus +5Total bonus: +33I don't think that any other kind of realistic character will come very close to this but on his best saving throw, a saving throw maximized character (4 classes, paladin with a 22 effective charisma, vest of resistance +5) would only make the DC of the iconic wizard's save on a 10+ roll.Given a weaker saving throw (will), the paladin only hasBase will save +12 IIRCWisdom bonus +3Charisma bonus +6Resistance bonus +5Total bonus +27Now the save maximized paladin needs to roll a 16+ in order to save against even the simplest of enchantments.The problem would be even worse at mid levels.Iconic 8th level cleric's hold person spell: Wis 20 (+2 level, +2 enhancement), your proposed feat--base DC 25With new feat and spell focus Enchantment: DC 27With new feat and Greater spell focus Enchantment: DC 29Without your feat but with spell focus enchantment: DC 19Without your feat but with greater spell focus: DC 21Without any DC enhancers: DC 17Your typical 8th level foes:8th level raging barbarian with the iron will feat: Will save +68th level fighter with the iron will feat: Will save +48th level wizard: Will save +68th level cleric: Will save +118th level monk: Will save +9 (+11 vs enchantment)With your feat, the characters with the best will saves go from having to roll a 10 to save against the greater spell focus version to having to roll an 18--something like a 70% reduction in their success rate for the cost of one more feat.Characters like the fighter and barbarian go from being able to save against the normal spell on a roll of an 11 to 13 to needing a natural 19 or 20 to save (and the 19 only works if the barbarian is raging). For one feat, that's about an 80% reduction in the save rate.In contrast, even a powerful feat like greater spell focus (really two feats since you need spell focus as well) only takes the worst will save of the bunch (where it makes the most difference) down from being able to save on a 13 to being able to save on a 17--in the (almost) best case, a mere 50% reduction in the save rate for the cost of two feats.On the other hand, your proposed feat seems to pretty reliably cut the save rate by 70% to 80% in the worst case scenarios. And if the cleric wants to make things worse, he can use a bead of karma to bump all his DCs up by 4.</blockquote>

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