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<blockquote data-quote="Libramarian" data-source="post: 6318530" data-attributes="member: 6688858">I ran AD&amp;D for 6 hours yesterday (the old Dungeon adventure &quot;Falcon's Peak&quot;--a nice SWAT mission-style 'realistic' dungeon). I&nbsp; implemented the&nbsp; change to spellcasting initiative and I like the&nbsp; randomness it adds to&nbsp; spell vs. spell and charge vs. spell. The 1e&nbsp; initiative system is&nbsp; really not too bad. Melee and spell initiative is all fine and I think&nbsp; it&nbsp; adds enough to the game to be worth the complexity. The only part&nbsp; for me&nbsp; that is truly a PITA is dealing with movement in segments,&nbsp; especially&nbsp; when combined with missile range categories.E.g.3 hobgoblins are charging an archer from 80' away. How many arrows can they get off in time?Monsters rolled a 3 initiative and the archer has 16 Dex so -1 modifier.PC fires at 2 and 5 (I say ROF 2 missile weapons fire 3 segments apart, and ROF 3 fire 2 segments apart)Hobgoblins have 9&quot; movement, but are charging so 18&quot;, which means 18' per segment.At segment 2 the hobgoblins have moved 18 * 2 = 36'. PCs gets their first shot here.80' - 36' = 44' away from PC (compare to range categories to determine if there is a penalty. No penalty)In 5 segments the hobgobs can move 5 * 18 = 90', which is &gt; 80' so the PC can't get their second shot off in time.This&nbsp; is too much for me in the heat of battle. I'm going&nbsp; to make a&nbsp; movement rate * segments = distance table and see&nbsp; how much that helps.I think it's clear&nbsp; what the effect is meant&nbsp; to be for the first two encumbrance categories&nbsp; (at 12&quot; you get your&nbsp; full Reaction/Initiative bonus, at 9&quot; you lose it)&nbsp; but it's definitely&nbsp; not spelled out what &quot;slowed&quot; and &quot;slowed greatly&quot;&nbsp; mean for the next&nbsp; two categories.It's not mentioned what the initiative&nbsp;&nbsp; rolls were, only that B wins, so this could make sense if A rolled&nbsp; a 1&nbsp; and Arlanni is using a broadsword or longsword (SF 5).This is truly&nbsp; strange and I have no explanation for it. I don't like the sound of&nbsp; that...so I'm not going to try to find one <img src="http://www.enworld.org/forum/images/smilies/nervous.png"&nbsp; class="smilie" loading="lazy" alt=":heh:" title="Nervous Laugh&nbsp; &nbsp; :heh:" data-shortname=":heh:" />I actually like this idea: spells cannot be completed during surprise&nbsp; but if you begin casting during surprise you can skip initiative in the&nbsp; first round (so you complete the spell after the casting time in&nbsp; segments into the first round without referring to the other side's&nbsp; initiative roll). Even though the sleep spell will complete just 1&nbsp; segment into the round, the other side always gets a chance to interrupt&nbsp; if they win initiative, so the orc could interrupt the spell. This&nbsp; would also solve the problem&nbsp; @<a href="http://www.enworld.org/forum/member.php?u=42582" target="_blank">pemerton</a>&nbsp; brought up about how to resolve&nbsp; AoE spells during surprise where some targets are no longer surprised.However it's definitely in conflict with the DMG combat example because&nbsp; Gutboy is hit by Command and Magic Missile while surprised.No, I don't think so. On DMG p 63 under Missile Discharge it mentions&nbsp; using the Item Saving Throw table to determine what happens to an arrow&nbsp; that fires at the same time as the discharge of a fireball spell.</blockquote>

[QUOTE="Libramarian, post: 6318530, member: 6688858"] I ran AD&D for 6 hours yesterday (the old Dungeon adventure "Falcon's Peak"--a nice SWAT mission-style 'realistic' dungeon). I implemented the change to spellcasting initiative and I like the randomness it adds to spell vs. spell and charge vs. spell. The 1e initiative system is really not too bad. Melee and spell initiative is all fine and I think it adds enough to the game to be worth the complexity. The only part for me that is truly a PITA is dealing with movement in segments, especially when combined with missile range categories. E.g. 3 hobgoblins are charging an archer from 80' away. How many arrows can they get off in time? Monsters rolled a 3 initiative and the archer has 16 Dex so -1 modifier. PC fires at 2 and 5 (I say ROF 2 missile weapons fire 3 segments apart, and ROF 3 fire 2 segments apart) Hobgoblins have 9" movement, but are charging so 18", which means 18' per segment. At segment 2 the hobgoblins have moved 18 * 2 = 36'. PCs gets their first shot here. 80' - 36' = 44' away from PC (compare to range categories to determine if there is a penalty. No penalty) In 5 segments the hobgobs can move 5 * 18 = 90', which is > 80' so the PC can't get their second shot off in time. This is too much for me in the heat of battle. I'm going to make a movement rate * segments = distance table and see how much that helps. I think it's clear what the effect is meant to be for the first two encumbrance categories (at 12" you get your full Reaction/Initiative bonus, at 9" you lose it) but it's definitely not spelled out what "slowed" and "slowed greatly" mean for the next two categories. It's not mentioned what the initiative rolls were, only that B wins, so this could make sense if A rolled a 1 and Arlanni is using a broadsword or longsword (SF 5). This is truly strange and I have no explanation for it. I don't like the sound of that...so I'm not going to try to find one :heh: I actually like this idea: spells cannot be completed during surprise but if you begin casting during surprise you can skip initiative in the first round (so you complete the spell after the casting time in segments into the first round without referring to the other side's initiative roll). Even though the sleep spell will complete just 1 segment into the round, the other side always gets a chance to interrupt if they win initiative, so the orc could interrupt the spell. This would also solve the problem @[I][B][U][URL="http://www.enworld.org/forum/member.php?u=42582"]pemerton[/URL][/U][/B][/I] brought up about how to resolve AoE spells during surprise where some targets are no longer surprised. However it's definitely in conflict with the DMG combat example because Gutboy is hit by Command and Magic Missile while surprised. No, I don't think so. On DMG p 63 under Missile Discharge it mentions using the Item Saving Throw table to determine what happens to an arrow that fires at the same time as the discharge of a fireball spell. [/QUOTE]

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