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Message: <blockquote data-quote="fourthmensch" data-source="post: 1710308" data-attributes="member: 16723">So I've been playing this 3e thing for over two years now, and certain aspects of the system are becoming more and more prominent as the PCs reach higher and higher levels. And by "more prominent," I mean something like I'm not sure that I really like this whole deal, but its pretty much welded into the core of the system and there isn't a damn thing I can do about it.  Chief among these items are spells, namely the number and complexity of spells that come into play on a consistent basis.  Disclaimer: While the purpose of me starting this thread, I admit, is to vent a little of my frustration, I wish to be perfectly clear that I am not expressing difficulty with or dislike of high-level adventuring per se, and especially not the effects of very powerful spells. That's a whole other can of worms.  What I'm really getting at is the effect that magic has on the game (as opposed to the plot or the adventure, if that distinction can be meaningfully made). A 15th level wizard can cast something on the order of 35-40 spells per day, which doesn't even take into account scrolls or (for clerics rather than wizards) the extra domain slots. That's a lot of freaking spells. Each one has a very specific stat block and description, with differing areas of effect, durations, ranges, and all kinds of special cases that have to be adjudicated specifically in the spell description.   I have to admit, this has become a constant drag on the game. I need to look up a spell probably half the time it is cast in order to be sure that it is being used with the right range, casting time, etc. (this actually happens seldomly; but the next category happens all the time) or because it is being used by creative players in innovative ways and there is a need to figure out exactly what is going to happen.   Perhaps I am insufficiently familiar with the rules--I concede the possibility. There may be any number of things I, as a DM, am doing wrong and therefore allowing this situation to get out of hand. But I think it is probably an underlying dissatisfaction with the entire Vancian magic system, which in my opinion (these days, at least) seems overly rigid and complex.   So that was the venting part. Thanks for reading, those of you who are still with me. What I'd like to know is, do others feel the same way? Still liking sword and sorcery and high magic, but simply dissatisfied with the D&D spellcasting system? Has anyone ever tried to give it a major overhaul, and totally rethink the way that characters cast spells? I think I would like to give something like that a try, but I'm not sure how successful a system I'm going to cook up on my own. The only other basis for spellcasting that I can think of is something along the lines of the way the Force is handled in Star Wars: separate skills that spellcasters would invest ranks in, and then roll a skill check to achieve a desired effect. If there are alternative spellcasting systems out there, can anyone point me to them?</blockquote>

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