Spontaneous Monster Generation

[Bullgrit]

In the Crackpot Science thread, I mentioned that the old belief of Spontaneous Generation could be used in fantasy as a monster generator, ala some computer games.

I kind of like the idea that some monsters "just appear" in unattended dungeon environments the way that it was believed rats "just appear" when you leave out old clothing and food scraps in a dark corner of a barn. Beware the dark of the attic without a lantern, because you might be eaten by a grue. Where does the grue come from? The dark of the attic.

I could see goblins and orcs being not "creature of nature" but rather things that just spontaneously generate in dark dungeons. There are no male, female, or child goblins, there are just goblins.

Spontaneous generation could explain how goblins appear behind the party, in areas they've already cleared in the dungeon. Why you must always have a guard awake even in a secured room. Why there are still more ghouls in the graveyard after the cleric went through and destroyed the last batch.

But here's my question:

How long could this concept be kept up? Could this concept be true for a whole campaign and world, or is it only good for one dungeon, or a single adventure? Some problems I can think of with spontaneous generation would be:

Where do the weapons come from, and if they are generated with the goblins (or whatever), where do they go after the goblin is slain? Would there be a stockpile of shortswords?

Could one create a "goblin farm" by letting a dungeon fill up, conscripting the produced goblins (or whatever) out of the dungeon, to let it fill up again?

Do the generated monsters have knowledge of their environment? The world?

What kind of creatures could be spontaneously generated, and what kind of creatures should not be? Goblins, orcs, dwarves, elves?

What do you think? Is spontaneous monster generation something that could be maintained for a whole campaign world, or is it just a neat gimmick for one dungeon, or one short adventure where the "global implications" wouldn't have to be considered?

Bullgrit

 

[BriarMonkey]

It's a neat idea, but as you ask there are a lot of questions that could come up. I think the relevance of the questions would have more to do with your group than anything else. If they are inquisitive and like plumbing the depths of the world behind the dungeons, then yeah, these could be problematic. Otherwise, if the party is more a kill-n-loot style, they won't care if the goblin knows who he is.

To that end, assuming that the party does have some care about how the world works, and that you as a GM don't want to introduce something that could wreck havoc, I'd think this idea would be best served by its use within a single environment. That environment could be a dungeon, or it could be a specific woods, or catacombs - or even a geological feature such as a specific valley.

The types of creatures that are spontaneous I think would depend on the environment. For something like a volcano, maybe mephits or elementals; a dungeon may spawn goblins; while catacombs just yell out for undead.

Too, the spawn rate may be different for different areas. I'd set a range of random timings, in trying to keep up with a specific feel. For instance, for a catacomb that spawns undead, if it is well known as a death trap, I'd spawn low-level mobs maybe once a day, but greater undead, like shadows or wraiths, maybe once a week.

But there too are a continuum of questions. For the intelligent creatures so spawned, I'd give them some base knowledge of the environment into which they are created. As for their gear, I waffle and don't have a good answer for that. As for unintelligent, they probably don't have gear - so that's not a concern. And as for their knowledge, they'd just mope around on instinct.

Ya know, as I think about it, there's no reason you couldn't have this for several areas, each with their own ecosystem. Hidden gates or portals, excessively thin layers between planes, magical plagues, cataclysms, or other historic failings could easily be used to describe or explain them.

Um, I think that covers my ramblings. If I missed something, note it and I'll try to re-engage ye olde noggin.

 

[Ed_Laprade]

I think that using this idea 'globally' could run into serious problems. Even using it in a few dungeons could be, if they aren't cleared out on a regular basis. Otherwise the world could find itself up to its eyebrows in Goblins, or whatever, with no hope of ever getting rid of them. Of course, claiming that they have a fast birth rate can do the same thing, but at least once they're dead, they're dead. (Until someone comes along and makes them Undead, anyway. )

 

[S'mon]

I like the idea a lot, and I've seen it before - AIR the suggestion was that Orcs don't destroy civilisation; Orcs spontaneously appear in the ruins where civilisation has fallen. I think it's a great way to create a mythic-feeling world rather than one of 'Gygaxian Naturalism'.

I'd suggest that the weapons, armour etc that generate with the Orcs rapidly corrode away once the Orc is killed, likewise for other creatures.

Spontaneously generated creatures should kill & eat each other; and there is a limit to how many you'd find in a dungeon; an unattended dungeon won't create an infinite number of Orcs.

I think most D&D settings may take some tweaking to use this idea, but it would work great with eg Dragon Warriors.

 

[Hand of Evil]

I always placed this in my "planes" setup. There are places that allow things to slide over if conditions are right, it is how the world works.

Creatures of shadow, can find a door when the moon is full and the wolfweed blooms. Or when shadow inverts a holy symbol. The dead shall walk on all hollows eve, so stay in doors. The wild hunt comes and goes but it is aways chasing the dark of the moon.

It is all built into the set-up of your world, the planes and world-myth.

 

[ExploderWizard]

This idea could be used to design other planar quests for PCs.

A mischevious otherworldly being has overclocked the spawn timer in the realm of shadow resulting in a deadly wave of undead monsters!! Brave adventurers are needed to venture forth and apply the patch that will nerf the spawn rate.

 

[Gilladian]

There was a cool article on abiogenesis a year or two back on Kobold Quarterly. I suggest finding and reading it.

IMCW, vermin, oozes, animals can all spontaneously generate in the right circumstances. So can the unintelligent undead (skeletons, zombies, even ghouls). And dragons.

Dragons are intelligent but solitary creatures. They have no gender, and they do not mate. However, their treasure hoards are gathered deliberately, because they produce the conditions to generate and incubate dragon eggs. A dragon who wishes to reproduce "feeds" its hoard just the right ingredients to produce the offspring it wishes to create.

 

[DMH]

Kobold Quarterly #4 and D Infinity #1 had articles on spontaneous generation (the latter written by me).

I broke it down into 3 forms- natural laws, divine intervention (ie when the gods tinker with the natural laws) and alchemy (ie when mortals tinker with natural laws) and wrote up a few examples for each in Labyrinth Lord stats.

How long could this concept be kept up? Could this concept be true for a whole campaign and world, or is it only good for one dungeon, or a single adventure?

I apply it setting wide. The only differences are when gods and people start muddying the waters of creation.

Where do the weapons come from, and if they are generated with the goblins (or whatever), where do they go after the goblin is slain? Would there be a stockpile of shortswords?

The first goblins took them from those they slew and subsequent generations (produced biologically and generated) have since picked up forging and other skills.

Could one create a "goblin farm" by letting a dungeon fill up, conscripting the produced goblins (or whatever) out of the dungeon, to let it fill up again?

Sure. Though I am not sure how much the people would want something anywhere near their farms and homes.

Do the generated monsters have knowledge of their environment? The world?

That is a good question. It depends on their origins. I would say yes but only those that are divine in origin.

What kind of creatures could be spontaneously generated, and what kind of creatures should not be? Goblins, orcs, dwarves, elves?

Everything from humans to dragons. It depends on how you look at spontaneous generation and biology for undead, elementals and constructs. I don't use undead but constructs and elementals can be spontaneously generated though they are not alive (per se for elementals).

What do you think? Is spontaneous monster generation something that could be maintained for a whole campaign world, or is it just a neat gimmick for one dungeon, or one short adventure where the "global implications" wouldn't have to be considered?

I don't see how they could be restricted to a single location without divine intervention and I use the idea for several different settings (including nanite created creatures for Gamma World and Mutant Future).

One thing you should keep in mind is that historical spontaneous generation didn't have life appear from nothing. I use conservation of mass so if a hundred goblins are generated, I need to convert ~10,000 pounds of something (soil, corpses, bedrock, fungi) to justify their existence.

Another thing is population density. The article from KQ mentions how high density (or good biological reproduction) will inhibit spontaneous generation. I took that to heart (though I read it only after I wrote my own). If the population of goblins goes below 150 per square mile for certain locations, then spontaneous generation is then possible.

 

[DMH]

Looking through some books, there are already a few creatures that arise from SG. The only D&D one that I could find is the mudman (something I think could be expanded easily). Then there is a dragon in Draconic Lore from FFG, it arises in near volcanos on the bottom of the ocean. And then there is the fey from Behemoth3's book on stirges. It arises from trees that the fey colonize.

Speaking of fey, shouldn't some or most of them come from SG?