spot, listen, hide, move silently

[ruleslawyer]

Absolutely. In fact, you'll note that the encounter example in the DMG (the one with the trolls) has them taking 10. I do this with most monsters, just to make it easy on myself as a DM.

 

[Crothian]

Ya, the take ten rule is a DM's best friend. Not only is it wasy to do, but the PCs don't start thinking something's up cause you just rolled a die.

 

[mmu1]

Sure, he could Take 10. I don't think it'd be a particularly good idea, though, unless you have a character with spot an listen as class skills.

Most classes are going to miss a lot of creatures that way - most things with a half-decent hide check often won't be spotted with a Take 10, even at low levels, (espcially at a distance or in poor light) so not rolling works against you - if your Take 10 result isn't good enough, rolling under 10 doesn't hurt you anyway, and rolling above 10 works for you... So non-rogues and non-rangers are generally better off roliing anyway.

 

[(Psi)SeveredHead]

You make new Hide vs Spot checks whenever you close half of the remaining distance, to a minimum of 30 feet. So if the ranger is 400 feet away, he and the cleric make opposed checks at 400 feet, 200 feet, 100 feet, 50 feet, and 30 feet. Of course, the ranger could open fire with his bow or cast a spell at 100 feet if he feels like it.

Use Move Silently vs Listen if the Listener is more likely to make that checks (for instance, if the ranger drank a potion of invisibility, if the cleric has a good Listen check, if the ranger has a poor Move Silently check, etc).

Hope that helps.

 

[Ferox4]

You make new Hide vs Spot checks whenever you close half of the remaining distance, to a minimum of 30 feet. So if the ranger is 400 feet away, he and the cleric make opposed checks at 400 feet, 200 feet, 100 feet, 50 feet, and 30 feet.

Huh?

Read my previous post and also Dr. Zoom's -- this is how Spotting, Listening and Hiding work over distance. Opposed checks do not occur until characters are within half the encounter distance (unspotted), and then can occur on every subsequent round -- albeit as a full round action (for the Spotter and/or Listener).

edited for content

 

[smetzger]

Huh?

Read my previous post and also Dr. Zoom's -- this is how Spotting, Listening and Hiding work over distance. Opposed checks do not occur until characters are within half the encounter distance (unspotted), and then can occur on every subsequent round -- albeit as a full round action (for the Spotter and/or Listener).

edited for content

I don't think that is exactly correct. From the description the Ranger who is doing the sneaking knows that the other group is there. Therefore he is technically in combat and the encounter has already started. You should then go to a surprise round for the Ranger who if he remains unnoticed can continue to sneak up making opposed rolls every round.

That being said the rules for encounter distance and the rules for Hide vs Spot are contradictory and I think its up to the individual DM to determine which rules he will use.

 

[Artoomis]

Hmm. How about this:
Ranger A sneaks towards the group which is 200 feet away.
He Hides, rolls (with all his bonus) a 10 on Hide.
Cleric B tries to guard the group. He rolls a 11 on Spot, without the penalties from beeing 200 feet away. These penalties (-20) would make it a effetive -9.
If you do not want to roll every time, you should assume that these roll results stay this way, only the circumstance modifier change. So, when the Ranger is a at 10 (or 20? Mathematics... ARGH) Feet the Cleric will spot him and may alarm his group...

I think this is the best way to handle this, and it avoids rerolling all the time...

This seems to make the most sense to me. Further, doing it this way seems to pretty much follow the rules as written AND makes it easier on the DM - he know when the Ranger will be spotted, if at all.

To make it even easier, have everyone in the party make a "Spot" roll for their time on watch during the night (or let them "take 10" if they'd rather do that then roll). Use this roll to determine when any bad guys might be spotted.

Use the same technique for Listen vs. Move Silently.

That should make this easier on the DM and, as a bonus, doesn't have players getting a clue that "somethings up" because they had to roll dice.

 

[Ferox4]

I don't think that is exactly correct. From the description the Ranger who is doing the sneaking knows that the other group is there. Therefore he is technically in combat and the encounter has already started. You should then go to a surprise round for the Ranger who if he remains unnoticed can continue to sneak up making opposed rolls every round.

That being said the rules for encounter distance and the rules for Hide vs Spot are contradictory and I think its up to the individual DM to determine which rules he will use.

Exactly how are they contradictory? It is very clear IMO. Also, when something is sneaking up on you and you're unaware you are NOT in combat. Besides, being in combat or not being in combat is pointless when it comes to Spotting. It's all about distance: the person on watch is simply rolling against a set DC until the sneaker gets within the specified range for opposed rolls. I'm sorry, but I don't see the confusion.

And yes, every DM can handle these situations as they deem fit. I am merely answering the question as per the guidelines that have been provided for 3E. IMO, it is a fine system for encounters and besides, why the hell is a Cleric standing watch anyway?

 

[(Psi)SeveredHead]

I looked at the DnD FAQ. Maybe it contradicts the rules.