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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Ratskinner" data-source="post: 7442777" data-attributes="member: 6688937">Phone makes it hard to edit quotes so pardon the general response.Re: the BorgFirst to be clear. There are no underlying mechanics. Its a tv show. And I just can't interpret the narrative that way at all. The Borg basically stop adapting by the time Voyager is dealing with them. I mean, these techno zombies with their much vaunted ability to adapt have to come to Voyager for help adapting to species 8472? In another episode we see some clever farmers have infected their kids with an antiborg virus? The decreasing threat that The Borg present has a lot more to do with the writers backing off after they realized they painted themselves into a corner, than the characters "leveling or anything similar". I mean they start "rotating frequencies" very quickly....and that just sorta ends that problem.Regarding opposition. In D&D, yes, there is (or can be) the treadmill. But again, Trek doesn't really fit that model. The planet-of-the-week really doesn't fit any curve of advancement. All we can really guarantee is that the transporter will only work if and when it is dramatically expedient. Regarding buy-in: yes. I'm willing to say that you have a handle on what I'm getting at. My experience with players in multiple systems doesn't match yours. In a traditional combat-centric game (D&D (multiple editions), Boot Hill, Savage Worlds, GURPS, etc.) I always see the players reverting to murderhobo methods, especially if they come to feel untouchable by law enforcement (as setting appropriate).  In part, I think this because "it only takes one" of the PCs to start shooting/torturing/whatever. In another part, traditional games tend to lack clear non-combat resolution systems and thus there is a lot of "when all you have is a hammer, everything is a nail" going on. IME, players choose concrete resolution over talking, whenever possible.And that's where I do think system matters, in the absence of player "buy in". Gumshoe, since we're there, starts with a wholly different mindset for its design. Its focus is on the narrative/logical flow of investigative scenarios, not on being a combat engine. And that changes how the players can approach the game wrt resolving their problems. When you put your players in moral grey areas, they might actually have better answers that "I kill them all."Whew. Sleepy now gotta go.</blockquote>

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