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Message: <blockquote data-quote="GMforPowergamers" data-source="post: 6471263" data-attributes="member: 67338">well of the 2 that really want to roll they both claim that it is randomness they want... but both also complain it is unfair if they roll low.one is a blatant "I want high stats" type, the other I can't figure eout at all. one of my players has recently gotten very rose colored glasses for looking at the past. when ever anyone points out any imbalance he says we are exaggerating. I pulled up posts form our message board and showed him his own complaints and he some how ignores or disbelieves them.example: in a 3.5 game he had 7 different compaints about another player (who isn't gaming with us anymore) cheating to get god like stats and being better then him. but he now says "That wasn't that bad I was mostly jokeing"in a pathfinder game full of people I knew would cheat I just wrote down the stats I wanted, and just told the DM that who was horrified... the funny part was the guy across the table from me was "Warming up his dice" during our discussion until he rolled an 18 then "That was my first roll that counted" and no one blinked because that was always how he did it...any who, last night we got togather and I suggestedyour choice of array: 1) 15, 14, 13, 12, 10, 8  2) 14, 14, 12, 12, 10, 10 3) 16, 14, 11, 11, 10, 10 and one of the players pitched a fit that there where no 18's, and that the number's were way too low. I just now (before coming here) got a post on our private board asking If I could change the array choices to 1) 17, 16, 15, 13, 10, 10  2) 16, 16, 14, 13, 11, 11 3) 18, 16, 13, 12, 11, 11 or if we could just roll, because without the option of starting with a 20 5e is going to suck <img src="http://www.enworld.org/forum/images/smilies/erm.png"  class="smilie" loading="lazy" alt=":erm:" title="Erm    :erm:" data-shortname=":erm:" />the player in question said that his other friends told him that everyone needs to have a 16+ con also or even kobolds can 1 shot barbarians. He also suggested (I wish I were kidding) the following roleing method.roll 5d6, reroll 1's and 2's drop the two lowest. Generate 13 numbers, take the 6 highest. if your highest isn't an 18 raise your highest to 18. if you have any numbers below 10 <img src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/joypixels/assets/8.0/png/unicode/64/1f642.png" class="smilie smilie--emoji" loading="lazy" width="64" height="64" alt="(:" title="Smile    (:"  data-smilie="1"data-shortname="(:" />erm: what are the odds of having a number less then 10) raise it to 10... then add race mods... <img src="http://www.enworld.org/forum/images/smilies/erm.png"  class="smilie" loading="lazy" alt=":erm:" title="Erm    :erm:" data-shortname=":erm:" /> yea, he then went on to say we could do that 2-3 times each then take the set we want...so I quickly before coming here tried this... I did 3 rows pre race and got1) 18,18,17,15,15,112) 18, 17, 16, 16,16,163) 18, 18, 18, 17, 17, 12<img src="http://www.enworld.org/forum/images/smilies/erm.png"  class="smilie" loading="lazy" alt=":erm:" title="Erm    :erm:" data-shortname=":erm:" /></blockquote>

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