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<blockquote data-quote="Kinematics" data-source="post: 9638778" data-attributes="member: 6932123">No, the foes cannot see him. Being Invisible is moot because another factor is already preventing him from being seen, so them having See Invisible makes no difference. Now, it might make a difference if he were to sneak off to the left, to get past foe #1 to that hallway over there. If they did not have See Invisible, you could make a case that he could slip by the foe without being seen. With See Invisible, it's reasonable to ask whether the foe automatically &quot;finds&quot; him when he moves out of the fog, due to him no longer benefiting from the Invisible condition.The problem seems to stem from how the Invisible condition is applied. With the Hide action rules, you have Invisible while hidden. See Invisible negates the Invisible condition. Does it negate the hidden pseudo-condition? The Invisible condition depends on the hidden condition, not the other way around (A → B, B ⌿&gt; A), so negating the Invisible condition does not have a single valid answer on whether the hidden condition is still in effect.</blockquote>

[QUOTE="Kinematics, post: 9638778, member: 6932123"] No, the foes cannot see him. Being Invisible is moot because another factor is already preventing him from being seen, so them having See Invisible makes no difference. Now, it might make a difference if he were to sneak off to the left, to get past foe #1 to that hallway over there. If they did not have See Invisible, you could make a case that he could slip by the foe without being seen. With See Invisible, it's reasonable to ask whether the foe automatically "finds" him when he moves out of the fog, due to him no longer benefiting from the Invisible condition. The problem seems to stem from how the Invisible condition is applied. With the Hide action rules, you have Invisible while hidden. See Invisible negates the Invisible condition. Does it negate the hidden pseudo-condition? The Invisible condition depends on the hidden condition, not the other way around (A → B, B ⌿> A), so negating the Invisible condition does not have a single valid answer on whether the hidden condition is still in effect. [/QUOTE]

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