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<blockquote data-quote="Wyckedemus" data-source="post: 6070645" data-attributes="member: 1079">Remember however that we're not making two *skill* checks on either side of this supposed equation. Some people may still thinking in the 3E/4E mindset for &quot;skills.&quot;The Sneaking person is *not* making a Sneak check. He is making a single Dexterity ability check to try and avoid detection. If a Sneak/Stealth skill is applicable, he gets a bonus to the ability check.The observing creature is *not* making one or two Spot or Listen checks. He is making a single Wisdom ability check to try and perceive a hidden foe. If having good hearing would help him, he gets the Listen Bonus. Or if having particularly keen eyesight would help, he gets the Spot bonus. (Of course they wouldn't stack).This set up allows for for certain races and classes to excel in areas of expertise that make sense. These two &quot;skills&quot; are indeed different enough to be separated and they make logical sense in the world. Examples below.An Elf or a Ranger might have good vision and therefore a Spot bonus to appropriate ability checks. This is different compared to Listen because it works when there is too much noise, or if you're deafened, or under a silence effect that prevents a person from being able to listen properly.A Rogue or a Gnome might have good hearing and get a Listen bonus to appropriate ability checks. This is different compared to Spot because it works when there is total concealment or invisibility or a barrier like a door blocking line of sight. Having a single Perception skill is too all-encompassing and powerful when compared to most other skills. Skills are not supposed to be a more comprehensive bonus to an ability check. They are supposed to be situational.Does this make sense?</blockquote>

[QUOTE="Wyckedemus, post: 6070645, member: 1079"] Remember however that we're not making two *skill* checks on either side of this supposed equation. Some people may still thinking in the 3E/4E mindset for "skills." The Sneaking person is *not* making a Sneak check. He is making a single Dexterity ability check to try and avoid detection. If a Sneak/Stealth skill is applicable, he gets a bonus to the ability check. The observing creature is *not* making one or two Spot or Listen checks. He is making a single Wisdom ability check to try and perceive a hidden foe. If having good hearing would help him, he gets the Listen Bonus. Or if having particularly keen eyesight would help, he gets the Spot bonus. (Of course they wouldn't stack). This set up allows for for certain races and classes to excel in areas of expertise that make sense. These two "skills" are indeed different enough to be separated and they make logical sense in the world. Examples below. An Elf or a Ranger might have good vision and therefore a Spot bonus to appropriate ability checks. This is different compared to Listen because it works when there is too much noise, or if you're deafened, or under a silence effect that prevents a person from being able to listen properly. A Rogue or a Gnome might have good hearing and get a Listen bonus to appropriate ability checks. This is different compared to Spot because it works when there is total concealment or invisibility or a barrier like a door blocking line of sight. Having a single Perception skill is too all-encompassing and powerful when compared to most other skills. Skills are not supposed to be a more comprehensive bonus to an ability check. They are supposed to be situational. Does this make sense? [/QUOTE]

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