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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Paul Strack" data-source="post: 4402989" data-attributes="member: 71340">That isn't the argument I am making. The argument I am making is that *sometimes* Stealth grants you only a Combat Advantage, and other times it grants you both a Combat Advantage and protection from attacks via TWYCS.My argument is based, not on the Stealth rules, but on the TWYCS rules. In particular, the fact that the TWYCS rules only provide a mechanical benefit if your location is not known.That's not my core scenario. I regret, now, putting the Total Concealment vs Concealment question into my original post, because it is definitely muddying the waters.Consider this case: your rogue is sneaking along a line of bushes to get close to one group of guards. But there is another guard on the same side of the bushes as the rogue who can clearly see the rogue.My argument is, in this case, the rogue is not protected by TWYCS because the guard with a clear LOS can just point his position out to his friend. However, the rogue can still get a combat advantage against the guards that can't see him.If that scenario bothers you, reverse it and make it a group of PCs versus a sneaking monster. Say a goblin is "sneaking" up on the PCs in clear view of one of them but hidden behind cover from the rest. Why can't the PC with a clear view point out where the goblin is, eliminating the benefits of TWYCS?</blockquote>