Reply to thread

Message: <blockquote data-quote="Elder-Basilisk" data-source="post: 379859" data-attributes="member: 3146">I actually like the switch from saving throws to attack bonus in the case of blade, spear, arrow traps, etc.The reason is this: It really should make a difference whether the person attacked by the trap is wearing a robe with stars and a pointy hat or fullplate and a large wooden shield. For physical traps like spears, arrows, etc, there should be a chance that armor would stop the blow or minimize the damage. That would not be represented by a reflex save.The high attack bonusses for traps, I think, are representative of two things. First, it would appear that mechanical traps often have a lot more power behind them than a peasant's spear thrust. Second, as someone else mentioned, the trap is set to trigger when someone is in just the right place to be hit by the trap.Furthermore, you don't change the logical problem (if it is a problem) of a spear trap being more likely to hurt an adventurer than a peasant with a spear by switching to a reflex save. At first level, a typical fighter has an AC of 18 (dex, chain mail, shield). A peasant (commoner 1) with a spear (Atk +0) has a 15% chance of actually hurting the fighter. Since the first level fighter in question also has a reflex save of +1, your revised trap will also be far more likely to hurt the fighter unless you set the DC at 4. (And I assume that you're not planning for the typical DC for these reflex saves to be single digit. . . .)So, in the end, by house-ruling such traps to operate by reflex save (with a reflex save bonus granted by armor), you won't have changed the problem that you set out to change. (The fact that a spear trap is approximately a billion times more likely to hurt an adventurer than a peasant with a spear is). All you will have accomplished is:<ul> <li data-xf-list-type="ul"> *Eliminating the (admittedly dubious) benefits of the top four levels of Uncanny Dodge. *You now need to convert 1/2-2/3 of traps that you could otherwise take directly from the adventure or the books. *You have now introduced an odd mechanic to relfex saves so that you can't just say "give me a reflex save" but you have to say "give me a reflex save with/without your armor bonus." *You've opened a can of worms that begins with questions like "Can I apply my haste bonus to this reflex save as well--after all, it would have effected my armor class?" and "Do I need to roll another save in order to confirm the trap's crit?" and "I have improved evasion--I should take half damage from the arrow trap even though it hit right?" *You've screwed barbarians who used to be at least decent trap dodgers since they had an AC bonus against traps but now their reflex saves are no good and their armor isn't much to speak of either so they really aren't good against traps. *You've also reduced your options for making traps dangerous. Previously, if the party's saves were too good for them to take reasonable DC traps seriously, you could use attack roll traps instead. Now that all traps use the saving throw mechanic, you're stuck.</li> </ul>So in short, I don't think that you'll really get the more logically consistent game that you desire from this. (You don't want the traps to all be DC 4 do you?). And you will introduce a bit of unnecessary work for you (converting traps before using them) and a few rules headaches into the system. And I'm sure there will be unforseen consequences as well.</blockquote>

Verification