Menu
News
All News
Dungeons & Dragons
Level Up: Advanced 5th Edition
Pathfinder
Starfinder
Warhammer
2d20 System
Year Zero Engine
Industry News
Reviews
Dragon Reflections
White Dwarf Reflections
Columns
Weekly Digests
Weekly News Digest
Freebies, Sales & Bundles
RPG Print News
RPG Crowdfunding News
Game Content
ENterplanetary DimENsions
Mythological Figures
Opinion
Worlds of Design
Peregrine's Nest
RPG Evolution
Other Columns
From the Freelancing Frontline
Monster ENcyclopedia
WotC/TSR Alumni Look Back
4 Hours w/RSD (Ryan Dancey)
The Road to 3E (Jonathan Tweet)
Greenwood's Realms (Ed Greenwood)
Drawmij's TSR (Jim Ward)
Community
Forums & Topics
Forum List
Latest Posts
Forum list
*Dungeons & Dragons
Level Up: Advanced 5th Edition
D&D Older Editions, OSR, & D&D Variants
*TTRPGs General
*Pathfinder & Starfinder
EN Publishing
*Geek Talk & Media
Search forums
Chat/Discord
Resources
Wiki
Pages
Latest activity
Media
New media
New comments
Search media
Downloads
Latest reviews
Search resources
EN Publishing
Store
EN5ider
Adventures in ZEITGEIST
Awfully Cheerful Engine
What's OLD is NEW
Judge Dredd & The Worlds Of 2000AD
War of the Burning Sky
Level Up: Advanced 5E
Events & Releases
Upcoming Events
Private Events
Featured Events
Socials!
EN Publishing
Twitter
BlueSky
Facebook
Instagram
EN World
BlueSky
YouTube
Facebook
Twitter
Twitch
Podcast
Features
Top 5 RPGs Compiled Charts 2004-Present
Adventure Game Industry Market Research Summary (RPGs) V1.0
Ryan Dancey: Acquiring TSR
Q&A With Gary Gygax
D&D Rules FAQs
TSR, WotC, & Paizo: A Comparative History
D&D Pronunciation Guide
Million Dollar TTRPG Kickstarters
Tabletop RPG Podcast Hall of Fame
Eric Noah's Unofficial D&D 3rd Edition News
D&D in the Mainstream
D&D & RPG History
About Morrus
Log in
Register
What's new
Search
Search
Search titles only
By:
Forums & Topics
Forum List
Latest Posts
Forum list
*Dungeons & Dragons
Level Up: Advanced 5th Edition
D&D Older Editions, OSR, & D&D Variants
*TTRPGs General
*Pathfinder & Starfinder
EN Publishing
*Geek Talk & Media
Search forums
Chat/Discord
Menu
Log in
Register
Install the app
Install
Upgrade your account to a Community Supporter account and remove most of the site ads.
Community
General Tabletop Discussion
*TTRPGs General
Submitted for Your Consideration: Changes to ORIGINS Awards
JavaScript is disabled. For a better experience, please enable JavaScript in your browser before proceeding.
You are using an out of date browser. It may not display this or other websites correctly.
You should upgrade or use an
alternative browser
.
Reply to thread
Message
<blockquote data-quote="Fast Learner" data-source="post: 984523" data-attributes="member: 649"><p>I don't think your analogy works in gaming, though. Do you really buy a gaming product that you think might be inferior to another because you'll buy the other one... when?</p><p></p><p>It <em>is</em> true, certainly, that people buy products -- including games -- for all sorts of reasons not related to quality including pretty packaging, cool names, recognizable brands, release timing, advertising, the physical weight of the product (heavier usually seems more valuable), and probably a dozen other things that have absolutely nothing to do with whether or not the product is actually better or worse than another in terms of its core or "real" purpose.</p><p></p><p>But: what is the "best" item in a category? For example, in popular music I would argue that the best song is the one that people most like to buy, <em>regardless</em> of any music critic's perspective. It's the best simply because it's the most popular. If you're the average 14 year old then you want it because other people want it. It likely <em>became</em> the most popular due to all kinds of reasons, mostly good marketing, but that is how popular music is measured: its popularity.</p><p></p><p>Both popularity and awards are limited by exposure: if you never saw it you're certainly not going to buy it and you're probably not going to vote for it. As such it's highly likely that the most popular item in a category isn't necessarily the best, and the most highly awarded item isn't the best: at least not the best in some theoretical objective comparison of quality for the item's purpose.</p><p></p><p>When it comes to games, then, should popularity apply when determining the "best" product? Why not? Does anyone believe that those who nominate and award the Pulitzers have read and evaluated every possible piece of published writing that might apply, or that those who nominate and award the Nobel prizes have examined every potential winner? And even if they did, why would anyone believe that they're being even remotely "objective"?</p><p></p><p>As far as I'm concerned industry awards are and will always be about popularity and <em>highly</em> subjective judgement. To pretend that they're not is, in my opinion, idealism of the most unfortunate kind. </p><p></p><p>Revamping the Origins awards so they more accurately reflect the state of the industry <em>and</em> admit that popularity and subjectivity are the core of any award system makes perfect sense in my book.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Fast Learner, post: 984523, member: 649"] I don't think your analogy works in gaming, though. Do you really buy a gaming product that you think might be inferior to another because you'll buy the other one... when? It [i]is[/i] true, certainly, that people buy products -- including games -- for all sorts of reasons not related to quality including pretty packaging, cool names, recognizable brands, release timing, advertising, the physical weight of the product (heavier usually seems more valuable), and probably a dozen other things that have absolutely nothing to do with whether or not the product is actually better or worse than another in terms of its core or "real" purpose. But: what is the "best" item in a category? For example, in popular music I would argue that the best song is the one that people most like to buy, [i]regardless[/i] of any music critic's perspective. It's the best simply because it's the most popular. If you're the average 14 year old then you want it because other people want it. It likely [i]became[/i] the most popular due to all kinds of reasons, mostly good marketing, but that is how popular music is measured: its popularity. Both popularity and awards are limited by exposure: if you never saw it you're certainly not going to buy it and you're probably not going to vote for it. As such it's highly likely that the most popular item in a category isn't necessarily the best, and the most highly awarded item isn't the best: at least not the best in some theoretical objective comparison of quality for the item's purpose. When it comes to games, then, should popularity apply when determining the "best" product? Why not? Does anyone believe that those who nominate and award the Pulitzers have read and evaluated every possible piece of published writing that might apply, or that those who nominate and award the Nobel prizes have examined every potential winner? And even if they did, why would anyone believe that they're being even remotely "objective"? As far as I'm concerned industry awards are and will always be about popularity and [i]highly[/i] subjective judgement. To pretend that they're not is, in my opinion, idealism of the most unfortunate kind. Revamping the Origins awards so they more accurately reflect the state of the industry [i]and[/i] admit that popularity and subjectivity are the core of any award system makes perfect sense in my book. [/QUOTE]
Insert quotes…
Verification
Post reply
Community
General Tabletop Discussion
*TTRPGs General
Submitted for Your Consideration: Changes to ORIGINS Awards
Top