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Suggestion: Broken?
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<blockquote data-quote="Hexmage-EN" data-source="post: 8060363" data-attributes="member: 79428"><p>Normally I'm a "yes, and" kind of DM. I definitely let players get away with things in my previous campaign that by the rules they shouldn't have.</p><p></p><p>My take on Suggestion specifically is colored by my desire to feature yuan-ti heavily in a campaign, creatures that can all cast Suggestion. In looking online for how other DMs have handled this I've actually seen advice to remove the Suggestion spell from the yuan-ti and replace it with something else to keep game sessions from being bogged down by arguments over what is "reasonable". I don't want to go that far, but I do want a clear and consistent ruling on what the yuan-ti could force PCs to do with Suggestion.</p><p></p><p>Let's take a look at related spells:</p><p></p><ul> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Command: One word, wis save, first level, one round, many possible options.</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Charm Person: Charm effect, wis save (with advantage in combat), first level, one hour, considers the caster a trusted friend, breaks if attacked.</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Dominate Person: Wis save same as charm person and effectively complete telepathic control, one minute, but can be upcast to last up to 8 hours. Target makes a new save when they take damage.</li> </ul><p></p><p>Now on to Suggestion.</p><p></p><ul> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Suggestion: One or two sentences to describe a course of activity. It does not charm, although if you're immune to charm, you're immune to suggestion. Wis save, concentration 8 hours, must sound reasonable, breaks if attacked.</li> </ul><p></p><p>Like Command, the spell is very open-ended in what compulsion the caster can place. Unlike Charm Person, it does not specify that the affected creature would do anything a friend who trusts you would be willing to do. Unlike Dominate Person, you cannot give new commands (note, though, that Dominate Person at 5th-level lasts one minute and takes a casting at 8th-level to last the same eight hour duration that the 2nd-level Suggestion does).</p><p></p><p>Suggestion is most like an 8th-level casting of Dominate Person where the caster for whatever reason only uses it to issue one long-term command. The only limit to Suggestion is that it must sound "reasonable". If a fighter is in combat with a yuan-ti malison that is clearly another sword stroke away from death, would a Suggestion from it to "run away as far as you can" be "reasonable"?</p><p></p><p>To go back to the scenario presented in the OP, would an aboleth in combat find the extremely vague Suggestion to "naughty word off" "reasonable"?</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Hexmage-EN, post: 8060363, member: 79428"] Normally I'm a "yes, and" kind of DM. I definitely let players get away with things in my previous campaign that by the rules they shouldn't have. My take on Suggestion specifically is colored by my desire to feature yuan-ti heavily in a campaign, creatures that can all cast Suggestion. In looking online for how other DMs have handled this I've actually seen advice to remove the Suggestion spell from the yuan-ti and replace it with something else to keep game sessions from being bogged down by arguments over what is "reasonable". I don't want to go that far, but I do want a clear and consistent ruling on what the yuan-ti could force PCs to do with Suggestion. Let's take a look at related spells: [LIST] [*]Command: One word, wis save, first level, one round, many possible options. [*]Charm Person: Charm effect, wis save (with advantage in combat), first level, one hour, considers the caster a trusted friend, breaks if attacked. [*]Dominate Person: Wis save same as charm person and effectively complete telepathic control, one minute, but can be upcast to last up to 8 hours. Target makes a new save when they take damage. [/LIST] Now on to Suggestion. [LIST] [*]Suggestion: One or two sentences to describe a course of activity. It does not charm, although if you're immune to charm, you're immune to suggestion. Wis save, concentration 8 hours, must sound reasonable, breaks if attacked. [/LIST] Like Command, the spell is very open-ended in what compulsion the caster can place. Unlike Charm Person, it does not specify that the affected creature would do anything a friend who trusts you would be willing to do. Unlike Dominate Person, you cannot give new commands (note, though, that Dominate Person at 5th-level lasts one minute and takes a casting at 8th-level to last the same eight hour duration that the 2nd-level Suggestion does). Suggestion is most like an 8th-level casting of Dominate Person where the caster for whatever reason only uses it to issue one long-term command. The only limit to Suggestion is that it must sound "reasonable". If a fighter is in combat with a yuan-ti malison that is clearly another sword stroke away from death, would a Suggestion from it to "run away as far as you can" be "reasonable"? To go back to the scenario presented in the OP, would an aboleth in combat find the extremely vague Suggestion to "naughty word off" "reasonable"? [/QUOTE]
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