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General Tabletop Discussion
D&D Older Editions, OSR, & D&D Variants
suggestions for 4e ideas easy enough to HR now?
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<blockquote data-quote="JohnSnow" data-source="post: 3950207" data-attributes="member: 32164"><p>Coming from you Wulf, that compliment means a lot. But I'm enjoying the conversation, so I'll respond further.</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>Just a little more food for thought, since I couldn't put all my thoughts in the previous post, and this triggered some of the ones I'd left dormant.</p><p></p><p>It's been suggested (or stated?) that BAB and Defenses <em>escalate uniformly</em> for all classes. That's a HUGE step in the direction of balance. Then you can give each class a different attack style, potentially relying on a different attributes and targeting different defenses. For instance Wizards making intelligence-based magical attacks that can target Ref, or Will, or Fort Defense. Fighters, by contrast, are more likely to make a strength-based attack against AC.</p><p></p><p>Balance is a matter of keeping those class bonus differentiations to reasonable levels, so that they don't become ridiculous. That way, something that's challenging for the fighter is still achievable for the wizard or rogue.</p><p></p><p>By having damage escalate alongside hit points, combat at higher levels becomes a matter of scale. For instance, let's assume the following:</p><p></p><p>1st level fighter: 33 hp, Avg dmg per hit: 8.5 (1d8 + 4)</p><p></p><p>That assumes a Str bonus of +3, and a level bonus to damage of +1. It also assumes triple hit die at level 1 and a Con bonus of +3. That means that the fighter takes down himself with 4 average damage hits. If the fighter hit about 40% of the time (die roll of 13+), combat would last around 10 rounds. Using your combat powers can probably cut that almost in half. To keep that same ratio of damage per attack to hit points, you'd have to make sure that the base damage scaled more or less in line with average hit points. Or that you had more powers to use to increase damage.</p><p></p><p>That's certainly doable, but the math could get pretty complicated, and it might require revisiting certain sacred cows (like hit points per level). Be interesting to see how 4e handles all of it.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="JohnSnow, post: 3950207, member: 32164"] Coming from you Wulf, that compliment means a lot. But I'm enjoying the conversation, so I'll respond further. Just a little more food for thought, since I couldn't put all my thoughts in the previous post, and this triggered some of the ones I'd left dormant. It's been suggested (or stated?) that BAB and Defenses [i]escalate uniformly[/i] for all classes. That's a HUGE step in the direction of balance. Then you can give each class a different attack style, potentially relying on a different attributes and targeting different defenses. For instance Wizards making intelligence-based magical attacks that can target Ref, or Will, or Fort Defense. Fighters, by contrast, are more likely to make a strength-based attack against AC. Balance is a matter of keeping those class bonus differentiations to reasonable levels, so that they don't become ridiculous. That way, something that's challenging for the fighter is still achievable for the wizard or rogue. By having damage escalate alongside hit points, combat at higher levels becomes a matter of scale. For instance, let's assume the following: 1st level fighter: 33 hp, Avg dmg per hit: 8.5 (1d8 + 4) That assumes a Str bonus of +3, and a level bonus to damage of +1. It also assumes triple hit die at level 1 and a Con bonus of +3. That means that the fighter takes down himself with 4 average damage hits. If the fighter hit about 40% of the time (die roll of 13+), combat would last around 10 rounds. Using your combat powers can probably cut that almost in half. To keep that same ratio of damage per attack to hit points, you'd have to make sure that the base damage scaled more or less in line with average hit points. Or that you had more powers to use to increase damage. That's certainly doable, but the math could get pretty complicated, and it might require revisiting certain sacred cows (like hit points per level). Be interesting to see how 4e handles all of it. [/QUOTE]
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