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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Crazy Jerome" data-source="post: 5996964" data-attributes="member: 54877">Mulling over the various objections to tinkering or not tinkering with advantage, I've come up with an idea that might be a compromise.  The basic concept is that advantage/disadvantage comes in five stages (instead of the normal playtest three) but continues to not stack. No doubt someone can come up with better labels than "super", too:<ul> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Super Advantage - either you have some incredible ability that grants it outright, or you've got so many sources of advantage that the DM/table rules agree that it's been upgraded.</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Advantage - per rules.</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Standard - per rules.</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Disadvantage - per rules.</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Super Disadvantage - you are hosed by some nasty ability that imposes it outright, or you've got so many sources of disadvantage that the DM/table rules agree that it has been downgraded.</li> </ul>By outright ability, the super variants should be relatively rare. Maybe something like "Improved Invisibility" can grant super advantage on sneaking, for example. If class abilities grant it, they are situational and/or otherwise highly constrained.  Advantage continues to cancel Disadvantage, and vice versa. Super Advantage and Super Disadvantage cancel each other the same way.  Where this idea starts to shine is that Disadvantage turns Super Advantage into Advantage, while Advantage turns Super Disadvantage into Disadvantage. Thus there is no inherent grasping after one extra advantage or disadvantage to complicate the system all the time, except to the extent that you allow some threshold of each to morph into the super versions. If a group wants to leave it up to a DM to say, "Darn, that's too much. You upgrade to super," then you can play it that way. Or you can even ignore that option, and leave super versions only to particularly powerful effects. Or you can set a fixed amount of advantage or disadvantage that will trigger it, but not worry about counting until you think you might get there. For example, one group sets it at 4 sources to upgrade. That's high enough to not go fishing for one extra until you think you've got 3 sources. Meanwhile, the written mechanics otherwise stay the same for all of these groups. This is a "dial" that is meant to change the nature of play as it is adjusted. I think five stages are enough to satisfy most people still left a little unsatisfied with the granularity of the current model, while retaining the "opposite stages fully cancel each other without counting" part preserves most of the simplicity. Then the dial makes it possible to adjust the remaining complexity to taste. However, what do you think? Edit:  See jrowland below.  No matter what mix, you can only gain one extra die.</blockquote>

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