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<blockquote data-quote="Fieari" data-source="post: 5707875" data-attributes="member: 16221">That's part of the point, that it is very clearly beyond a normal boss fight.&nbsp; This is a climactic fight against someone very very clearly stronger than you... note that Winter Nymphs are normally level 15 standard creatures.This is definitely not something you STUMBLE upon.&nbsp; This is that fight.&nbsp; The one that in 3.x edition you would have researched and studied and planned for (but, since it was 3e, once you joined the battle, there'd be no real fight left, just execution of plan).This is the monster that is clearly beyond the players, but they get a shot at it anyway, because of sheer awesome epicness.As far as reading up on the obsidian system, the basics you need to know is that it's skill challenge that takes place during a fight, failures do not count against you, and you succeed upon a certain number of successes based on party size.&nbsp; For a group of 5, for instance, you'd need 8 successes spread across the entire party, which COULD be done in two rounds, except that it takes a move action to try a skill.&nbsp; And the fight is going on.Now, the skill checks in this proposed system aren't just to learn about the creature, but actually to actively combat it at the moment.With the example creature I gave, for instance, I imagined the skill checks to look for openings in the constant wind blasts, seeing how to manipulate her movements to a place where she can't quite as effectively use the aura, and so on and so forth. Each success moves the party closer to the point where they can get in that windy area without being blown back, either by compensating for the winds somehow or stopping her from using it.It's not just knowing about the creature, it's having to do more to kill it than swing a sword and a few spells around.&nbsp; Because the sword isn't going to cut it, this creature is plain better than you.&nbsp; 15 levels better, in this case.&nbsp; But in 4e, you can adjust the math, while still keeping the danger!</blockquote>

[QUOTE="Fieari, post: 5707875, member: 16221"] That's part of the point, that it is very clearly beyond a normal boss fight. This is a climactic fight against someone very very clearly stronger than you... note that Winter Nymphs are normally level 15 standard creatures. This is definitely not something you STUMBLE upon. This is [i]that[/i] fight. The one that in 3.x edition you would have researched and studied and planned for (but, since it was 3e, once you joined the battle, there'd be no real fight left, just execution of plan). This is the monster that is clearly beyond the players, but they get a shot at it anyway, because of sheer awesome epicness. As far as reading up on the obsidian system, the basics you need to know is that it's skill challenge that takes place during a fight, failures do not count against you, and you succeed upon a certain number of successes based on party size. For a group of 5, for instance, you'd need 8 successes spread across the entire party, which COULD be done in two rounds, except that it takes a move action to try a skill. And the fight is going on. Now, the skill checks in this proposed system aren't just to learn about the creature, but actually to actively combat it at the moment. With the example creature I gave, for instance, I imagined the skill checks to look for openings in the constant wind blasts, seeing how to manipulate her movements to a place where she can't quite as effectively use the aura, and so on and so forth. Each success moves the party closer to the point where they can get in that windy area without being blown back, either by compensating for the winds somehow or stopping her from using it. It's not just knowing about the creature, it's having to do more to kill it than swing a sword and a few spells around. Because the sword isn't going to cut it, this creature is plain better than you. 15 levels better, in this case. But in 4e, you can adjust the math, while still keeping the danger! [/QUOTE]

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