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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Tony Vargas" data-source="post: 7867562" data-attributes="member: 996">To be fair, the concept he was working with barely touched upon the 4e PH1 Tactical Warlord.And Resourceful and Skirmishing.  And the fan-instigated 'Lazy' builds that actually ended up getting substantial official support.   That's eight - as many as the highest-sub-class-count at release in the PH wizard had traditions. I saved it from a thread some time ago.[spoiler=Warlord sub-classes, raw format]So, just to pull together, further brainstorm, and generally spill electrons in needless carnage, a list of Warlord concepts for use as sub-classes, focusing on concept/flavor, rather than bothering with mechanics (I am assuming a strongly-mechanically-defined, very flexible class chassis with sub-classes granting specialization):Bravura: Always at the forefront, the Bravura inspires (and incites) by reckless example, seemingly fool-hardy bravery, and daring-do.  A Bravura may have a fierce rivalry with one or more of his allies, getting them to try to out-do eachother, and/or may try to protect others of his friends he views as needful of such.  Bravuras hail from cultures that value strength, toughness, fierceness, bravery, honor, courage, and daring above common sense, planning, precision, or prudence, and may will have preconceived notions which shape which allies go into which category, at least initially.Tactical/Commander: Very likely from a formal military background, or at least formal studies of military history, the tactician is a theorist, a planner, and a chess master playing with lives as the pieces.  It is a very serious profession, and one that few have the stomach for once they've watched other die for a failed - or even successful - plan.  Tacticians are sometimes idealistic, following an intellectual ideal, perhaps the greatest good for the greatest number, with some sacrifices being necessary, perhaps an ideal of perfect planning and execution or preparedness - whatever, those ideals rarely stand the test of time, and most tacticians eventually turn pragmatic, some even bitter and cynical.  Those few who achieve flawless, even bloodless, victories are enshrined in the obscure histories of their specialty, but rarely remembered as heroes by history, which places little value on such seemingly 'easy victories.'Inspiring: The inspiring warlord leverages natural charisma and skill at oratory, and sometimes, deceit - to propel allies to victory.  In the end, no matter what tacticians may say, victory is in already burning in the heart, it is the most determined, the most committed that win, and the inspiring warlord strives to bring that quality out in his allies.Skrimisher: Why fight a battle you can't win?  And why win a battle you don't need to fight?  The Skirmisher knows that victory goes not to the strongest, nor the smartest, nor even the most determined, but to the one who fights only when he can win.  Discretion is the better part of valor, and he who fights another day, may yet live on until that day when can win.  The Skirmisher delights in tactics that harry and drain the enemy, that draw them out of position, tempt them to over-extend themselves to finish the seeming-cowards who strike and melt away, only to find themselves surrounded, outnumbered, and doomed.  Ah, yes, the valiant last stand, death with honor - a fitting end, to the Skirmisher's enemies.  Protectors are capable individuals who take responsibility for the welfare of others.   Anywhere there's even a trace of civilization, people need to be guided and protected, often from eachother.  Protectors may work from a position of legitimate authority, like a peace officer or sheriff, they may be chosen by acclaim, looked to naturally in times of trouble, or even be self-appointed would-be heroes.  They make a point of guiding, keeping save, and, when necessary, saving others.  They will also tend to be adept at defusing potentially violent situations or resolving them with limited injury and loss of life.  They emphasize prudence, common sense, community spirit and organization.  Even when working with very capable even reckless allies like adventurers, the Protector counsels caution and careful, deliberate action - but, very often, Protectors do not heed their own advice, and may dash in to play the hero in moments of crisis.Resourceful: Focusing on preparedness and improvisation, the Resourceful warlord seeks to engineer any advantage he can for his allies - and also to take advantage of anything presented to them.  No plan survives first contact with the enemy and you can't eat love of country.  There are things, often very minor, very simple things, that can assure victory under the right circumstances.  For want of a nail, afterall, the Kingdom was lost.Insightful/Watcher:  If you know what your enemy wants, you can predict his actions.  If you know how he thinks, you can counter his tactics.  And, if you know where he is, he cannot surprise you.  The insightful warlord, or Watcher, is cautious and values planning, but, above all is alert for any clue of the enemy's movements and plans.The Artillerist: Whether actual medieval siege weapons, archers, or casters provide it, the advantage of a stand-off capability cannot be overstated. Setting up and making the most of that advantage is the specialty of this Warlord.  Where there are not source resource to direct, the Artillerist takes up whatever weapons are available to provide the direct advantages of ranged support to his allies - taking a shot at just the right moment, even if it is easily dodged or blocked, can give an ally an advantage or opening, or put an enemy out of it's best tactical position as it seeks over or crouches behind its shield...The Hector:  This is the warlord who harangues, taunts, deceives, and outmaneuvers the enemy into making tactical mistakes and generally playing into his hands.  The Hector focuses on his enemies more than his allies - allies, you should be able to count on.  The Hector's acid words are carefully chosen and wickedly delivered to goad enemies into the worst course of action before them.  You might think that such tactics are worthless against enemies who speak a different language or that lack the capacity for thought at all.  But, humanoids have many forms of expression in common besides words, and it takes only a passing knowledge of a culture to know what could set someone off.And 'mindless' enemies are the easiest of all to manipulate, as they are the most predictable of opponents.Teacher: Because I refuse to say 'Sensei' and I know what kinda reaction '(Martial Arts) Master' would provoke.  This is a Warlord who doesn't lead so much as educates and advises, a disciple of a martial philosophy, not just martial skills.  A teacher is always learning, himself, of course, and an ordinary (or aged) one might not have much practical fighting skill (anymore).  At low level, the teacher expounds an a general philosophy and the skills he has to impart are distinctive only in how they tie back into that - and help those using them work together.  Teachers are particularly good at devising and drilling maneuvers and tricks specific to a coming challenge, making use of Long rests and downtime to add versatility.The Marshal: This is the Warlord who, by whatever means, 'marshals' lesser troops - volunteers, conscripts, villagers, bandits, whatever - into an effective fighting force. It's a classic trope, 'training the villagers to fight for themselves' for instance, and, it side-steps one of the problems with attack-granting and barking commands: this Warlord doesn't have to do it with PCs, mussing their precious bad-boy doesn't-work-well-with-others edginess. He has his own NPC grunts to abuse. It also side-steps the problem with pet classes and henchmen: that they impact the action economy. The Marshal would have his unit of recruits that he commands to move around, holding positions, or making concerted attacks ("when you see the whites of their eyes!") of high value. All of which would be resolved by the player of the Marshal, on his turn, using his actions. A volley from his unit of archers, for instance, wouldn't be a bunch of attacks rolled by the DM one on each archers turn, rather, it'd be done on the Marshals' turn, and create a beaten zone, enemies in it would get skewered (save:1/2). That kinda thing. And, yes, it could include a warlord that 'marshals' animals bred & trained for combat, or a posse comitatus under the mantle of the law. (or those could be broken out and be good at similar gambits)The Icon (Princess or 'Lazylord'): Though not intended by the designers, a Warlord that isn't a capable fighter in its own right, and instead uses it's actions to inspire and incite allies, can cover a range of concepts not ever otherwise viable in D&D (nor most RPGs, really). The plucky side-kick who can't measure up to his heroes but who's antics, cooperation, and frequent need of saving bring out the most heroic in them. The psychologically important symbol (mascot, literal prince or princess, ringbearer, etc) who everyone in the party cares about on some level, and thus binds them together into a stronger whole. The victim in need of rescue. etc...... and, sure, if your group like the idea, the effete commander, "sipping Sancerre & directing the battle" from a safe distance.Then, in the spirit of adapting to 5e, the faux-MCing it seems to go for:Crusader: The 1/3rd Cleric or half-Paladin Warlord, a leader of zealots and champion of a divine cause, who, in the D&D world, obviously can't get away with it without displaying actual divine powers.Arcane Battlemaster (name lifted from a Paragon Path): In the D&D, spells very often turn the tide of battle, if not decide it from the beginning, so it only makes sense that there are commanders who shape their tactics around the effective use of caster assets, and, probably, pick up wizardry second-hand, INT-focused as the warlord can be.Infernal Strategist (ditto): Some will pay any price for victory. The Infernal Strategist employs both magical powers and diabolical gambits gleaned from the darkest and most perilous of arcane sources.The Thaneborn (name lifted from barbarian build - and thanks for reminding me of this one, Vince): A traditional leader of a clan or tribe or the like, by right of birth. The Thane leads 'his people' in battle, and others call those people 'barbarians'). A faux-Barbarian-MC who's rage is not as potent, but is 'contagious' to his allies.The Ardent:  assuming we ever get Psionics, a faux-MC Warlord/Psion who uses empathy and telempathy to channel his and his allies' emotions and belief in a cause.  Or, y'know, the Ardent could be the Psion(icist)'s faux-Warlord-MC, and the Warlord's could be called PsiCorps Commander or something, just to be silly - y'know, like Eldritch Knight and Bladesinger both come at elven fighter/magic-user from opposite sides.[/spoiler]TL;DR:InspiringTacticalBravuraResourcefulSkirmisherInsightful/WatcherArtilleristIcon ('LazyLord' - I like Garthanos's 'Princess Build,' but y'know, gender)MarshalTeacherProtectorHector...CrusaderArcane BattlemasterInfernal StrategistThanebornArdent</blockquote>

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