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Supposing D&D is gamist, what does that mean?
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<blockquote data-quote="Lyxen" data-source="post: 8622397" data-attributes="member: 7032025"><p>OK, this seems indeed fairly close to the WIkipedia definition of narrativism.</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>OK, now these are just labels used by specific theories. But then it means that collective telling of a story based on characters and their interactions hardly fits within the model.</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>OK, now this is, for me, pure theory. Skill Challenges are a purely gamist thing where people roll dices to get more successes than failures. The way I've seen it played, it just transforms role-playing in to roll-playing, with people seeing which of their technical skills are the best to roll dices and try justifying their use. How this is narrativism is really beyond me, especially when looking at the wikipedia definition: "Narrativism relies on outlining (or developing) character motives, placing characters into situations where those motives conflict and making their decisions the driving force. For example, a samurai sworn to honor and obey his lord might be tested when directed to fight his rebellious son; a compassionate doctor might have his charity tested by an enemy soldier under his care; or a student might have to decide whether to help her best friend cheat on an exam." How this is even close to a skill challenge is totally beyond me.</p><p></p><p>As for the adventuring day, I don't think many people follow things here in other editions, whereas, looking at 4e modules which are basically series of encounters at least as much as any other edition modules, I fail to see a difference here.</p><p></p><p>On the other hand "framing scenes and seeing where things go" is something that I've been doing all my life as a DM, including in 4e, but I must say that the clear separation of pillars of play in 4e (and the heavy formalism of combat had nothing to do with "dramatic need") was more of a hindrance to me with respect of seeing where things were going.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Lyxen, post: 8622397, member: 7032025"] OK, this seems indeed fairly close to the WIkipedia definition of narrativism. OK, now these are just labels used by specific theories. But then it means that collective telling of a story based on characters and their interactions hardly fits within the model. OK, now this is, for me, pure theory. Skill Challenges are a purely gamist thing where people roll dices to get more successes than failures. The way I've seen it played, it just transforms role-playing in to roll-playing, with people seeing which of their technical skills are the best to roll dices and try justifying their use. How this is narrativism is really beyond me, especially when looking at the wikipedia definition: "Narrativism relies on outlining (or developing) character motives, placing characters into situations where those motives conflict and making their decisions the driving force. For example, a samurai sworn to honor and obey his lord might be tested when directed to fight his rebellious son; a compassionate doctor might have his charity tested by an enemy soldier under his care; or a student might have to decide whether to help her best friend cheat on an exam." How this is even close to a skill challenge is totally beyond me. As for the adventuring day, I don't think many people follow things here in other editions, whereas, looking at 4e modules which are basically series of encounters at least as much as any other edition modules, I fail to see a difference here. On the other hand "framing scenes and seeing where things go" is something that I've been doing all my life as a DM, including in 4e, but I must say that the clear separation of pillars of play in 4e (and the heavy formalism of combat had nothing to do with "dramatic need") was more of a hindrance to me with respect of seeing where things were going. [/QUOTE]
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