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Message: <blockquote data-quote="AbdulAlhazred" data-source="post: 8640170" data-attributes="member: 82106"><p>Well, its a bit like the gamism of TB2, which really isn't that concerned with fictional considerations, they just kind of live in their own boxes. You can face obstacles of all sorts of Ob (DCs). It doesn't really matter. I mean, sure, if the GM piles on more ob, there will be more twists and conditions. This might lead to a character or party kill, but it won't obviate the Step On Up kind of nature of the process. So in the case of 4e, if you imagine there will be exactly a certain number of checks in an SC with certain DCs, and generally covering a certain range of skills, as long as the players know those facts, it isn't really that important what those exact values ARE in terms of gamist considerations. You face what you face, you overcome it (or not). A few minor cases where an SC turns out to not matter fictionally and get ditched are not really going to undermine the whole structure IMHO. Yes, the fiction and the mechanics in 4e are a bit less cleanly separated than in TB2, in a sense. Its still a lot cleaner than 5e as far as I can see.</p></blockquote><p></p>