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Symmetric Balance vs Asymmetric Balance.
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<blockquote data-quote="Maxperson" data-source="post: 9176204" data-attributes="member: 23751"><p>And spellcasting starting at level 4 and improving until you hit level 19. And different skills. And more skill points. And the lack of a ton of bonus feats. </p><p></p><p>That was in 3.0! Where they realized that they failed to achieve what a ranger is compared to a fighter. So let's go to 3.5 and look at what a ranger gets compared to what a fighter gets. </p><p></p><p>1. Better saves.</p><p>2. Favored enemies.</p><p>3. Track skill.</p><p>4. Wild Empathy</p><p>5. Bonus combat style</p><p>6. Endurance</p><p>7. Animal Companion</p><p>8. Woodland Stride</p><p>9. Spellcasting starting at level 4 and improving all the way until level 19</p><p>10. Evasion</p><p>11. Camouflage</p><p>12. Hide in Plain Sight</p><p></p><p>THAT is what a ranger is compared to a fighter. And the 3.5 fighter still just got a lot of bonus feats. You example where you disagree is an example of where they failed to create a ranger. When they did create a ranger in 3.5, there's no way a subclass can carry all of that.</p><p></p><p>In 4e the two classes were too different for a subclass to carry the differences. Even in 1e and 2e there were more differences than a subclass gives with 8 differences in 2e.</p><p></p><p>Also what you are overlooking in 5e is that rangers do not get and should not get the following.</p><p></p><p>1. Action Surge</p><p>2. Action Surge(2)</p><p>3. Second Wind</p><p>4. Extra Attacks(2)</p><p>5. Extra Attacks(3)</p><p>6. Indomitable</p><p>7. Indomitable(2)</p><p>8. Indomitable (3)</p><p></p><p>Ranger completely fails as a subclass of fighter.</p><p></p><p>No. That's not what prestige classes were at all. Prestige classes were what subclasses are. A way to differentiate the PC into a specialty of some sort.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Maxperson, post: 9176204, member: 23751"] And spellcasting starting at level 4 and improving until you hit level 19. And different skills. And more skill points. And the lack of a ton of bonus feats. That was in 3.0! Where they realized that they failed to achieve what a ranger is compared to a fighter. So let's go to 3.5 and look at what a ranger gets compared to what a fighter gets. 1. Better saves. 2. Favored enemies. 3. Track skill. 4. Wild Empathy 5. Bonus combat style 6. Endurance 7. Animal Companion 8. Woodland Stride 9. Spellcasting starting at level 4 and improving all the way until level 19 10. Evasion 11. Camouflage 12. Hide in Plain Sight THAT is what a ranger is compared to a fighter. And the 3.5 fighter still just got a lot of bonus feats. You example where you disagree is an example of where they failed to create a ranger. When they did create a ranger in 3.5, there's no way a subclass can carry all of that. In 4e the two classes were too different for a subclass to carry the differences. Even in 1e and 2e there were more differences than a subclass gives with 8 differences in 2e. Also what you are overlooking in 5e is that rangers do not get and should not get the following. 1. Action Surge 2. Action Surge(2) 3. Second Wind 4. Extra Attacks(2) 5. Extra Attacks(3) 6. Indomitable 7. Indomitable(2) 8. Indomitable (3) Ranger completely fails as a subclass of fighter. No. That's not what prestige classes were at all. Prestige classes were what subclasses are. A way to differentiate the PC into a specialty of some sort. [/QUOTE]
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