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*Pathfinder & Starfinder
Synthesist as a tank?
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<blockquote data-quote="SteelDraco" data-source="post: 5687885" data-attributes="member: 359"><p>So, I was thinking about something kooky for a recent thread ([MENTION=67606]Stumblewyk[/MENTION]'s "Help me build a tank!" thread, specifically). I looked over the synthesist summoner archetype, with a mind to turning it into a tank. Sure, your BAB isn't going to be great, but you have access to all those fun evolutions to play with, and since you use the best of you and your eidolon's scores (your mental and the eidolon's physical), you can get pretty impressive stats all around. Plus, the summoner's spell list is fairly impressive - it gets a number of personal-enhancement spells, some of them earlier than a wizard or druid. I started playing around with the idea, and had some questions about the mechanics of the class with regard to hit points.</p><p></p><p>It says you gain your eidolon's hit points as temporary hit points, in addition to your own. I'm curious how this interacts with the creature's hit points from Constitution bonuses and whether or not you recalculate the summoner's hit points based on the eidolon's Constitution score. Say, for example, that I have a 7th level summoner with a 10 Con base, plus a Belt of Constitution +2, for a total of 12 Con, giving him 7d8+7 hit points. This summoner has an eidolon with a 16 Con (13 base for biped, +1 from an ability increase, and +2 for an evolution). This would give the eidolon by itself 6d10+18 hit points.</p><p></p><p>When fused, the archetype says you use the eidolon's Constitution instead of your own, and that all items you're wearing continue to function. Presumably, since we're fused into one creature, the eidolon's Constitution increases due to the belt, since the synthesist uses its Constitution score. Therefore the synthesist and the eidolon both have an 18 Constitution. Right?</p><p></p><p>Would that mean that, when fused with his eidolon, the synthesist has 7d8+28 hit points, plus 6d10+24 temporary hit points from the eidolon? That seems... really good for a tank. Like, really really good. Am I missing something there?</p><p></p><p>Also, it seems like you can tank like a madman if you're so inclined, using evolutions and spells to your advantage. If I'm reading the rules right, each increase to your eidolon's Con modifier counts double, so Ability Increase (Constitution) is worth it. Improved Natural Armor gives +2 natural armor to AC for the low cost of one evolution point. You get your eidolon's armor bonus, so you'll be able to get a decent armor bonus, a good natural armor bonus you can further increase with Barkskin, plus whatever your eidolon's Dexterity score gives you. Summoners get a bunch of useful defensive and battlefield control spells as well (barkskin, blur, displacement, invisibility, walls, pits, black tentacles, etc). They get movement powers through evolutions as well, which tank-types normally have to beg spellcasters for.</p><p></p><p>About the only thing they don't get is bonus feats, and a lot of those can be replicated with evolutions. You can probably afford to spend your normal feats on combat stuff, though.</p><p></p><p>Thoughts? Has anybody tried a build like this? It's been added to my list of characters that I want to play, which is getting longer the more I play around with Pathfinder.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="SteelDraco, post: 5687885, member: 359"] So, I was thinking about something kooky for a recent thread ([MENTION=67606]Stumblewyk[/MENTION]'s "Help me build a tank!" thread, specifically). I looked over the synthesist summoner archetype, with a mind to turning it into a tank. Sure, your BAB isn't going to be great, but you have access to all those fun evolutions to play with, and since you use the best of you and your eidolon's scores (your mental and the eidolon's physical), you can get pretty impressive stats all around. Plus, the summoner's spell list is fairly impressive - it gets a number of personal-enhancement spells, some of them earlier than a wizard or druid. I started playing around with the idea, and had some questions about the mechanics of the class with regard to hit points. It says you gain your eidolon's hit points as temporary hit points, in addition to your own. I'm curious how this interacts with the creature's hit points from Constitution bonuses and whether or not you recalculate the summoner's hit points based on the eidolon's Constitution score. Say, for example, that I have a 7th level summoner with a 10 Con base, plus a Belt of Constitution +2, for a total of 12 Con, giving him 7d8+7 hit points. This summoner has an eidolon with a 16 Con (13 base for biped, +1 from an ability increase, and +2 for an evolution). This would give the eidolon by itself 6d10+18 hit points. When fused, the archetype says you use the eidolon's Constitution instead of your own, and that all items you're wearing continue to function. Presumably, since we're fused into one creature, the eidolon's Constitution increases due to the belt, since the synthesist uses its Constitution score. Therefore the synthesist and the eidolon both have an 18 Constitution. Right? Would that mean that, when fused with his eidolon, the synthesist has 7d8+28 hit points, plus 6d10+24 temporary hit points from the eidolon? That seems... really good for a tank. Like, really really good. Am I missing something there? Also, it seems like you can tank like a madman if you're so inclined, using evolutions and spells to your advantage. If I'm reading the rules right, each increase to your eidolon's Con modifier counts double, so Ability Increase (Constitution) is worth it. Improved Natural Armor gives +2 natural armor to AC for the low cost of one evolution point. You get your eidolon's armor bonus, so you'll be able to get a decent armor bonus, a good natural armor bonus you can further increase with Barkskin, plus whatever your eidolon's Dexterity score gives you. Summoners get a bunch of useful defensive and battlefield control spells as well (barkskin, blur, displacement, invisibility, walls, pits, black tentacles, etc). They get movement powers through evolutions as well, which tank-types normally have to beg spellcasters for. About the only thing they don't get is bonus feats, and a lot of those can be replicated with evolutions. You can probably afford to spend your normal feats on combat stuff, though. Thoughts? Has anybody tried a build like this? It's been added to my list of characters that I want to play, which is getting longer the more I play around with Pathfinder. [/QUOTE]
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