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Message: <blockquote data-quote="pemerton" data-source="post: 8418711" data-attributes="member: 42582">To be honest, I don't think I agree with that last sentence.In my 4e game, the PCs won a skill challenge - a social encounter. That was the end of that session. The next session began with me framing the combat that followed on from that challenge. As I was stating part of my framing, one of the players pulled me up, and reminded me that as a result of the players' success in the skill challenge, it was established in the fiction that everyone knew the evil advisor, and not the PCs, was responsible for the bad stuff that was happening.That's enforcement of a principle (in this case, of respecting the established consequences as binding). To my mind it's no different from pointing out that someone added up their AC wrong. In both cases - given we're talking about a leisure activity - the process and sanctions for "enforcement" are purely informal social ones.Another example: in the BW game where I'm a player, the GM had framed a scene involving elves (he loves elves!). I could see what he was doing - it evoked memories of other games and sessions we'd played together - but it didn't connect to my own priorities (Beliefs, etc) for my character. So, following the advice to players set out in the rulebook, I declared an action that would reorient things - I tried to persuade the elf captain to accompany me back to my ancestral homeland so he could help me deal with the evil that festers there! I knew that I had little or no chance of winning this Duel of Wits - and that turned out to be the case! I didn't even get a compromise - but the process itself was enough to bring the game back onto its principled focus: my PC and his struggles.I think it distorts our understanding to trot out cliches like the players only recourse is to quit the game or there is no solution to principles-violating play other than not to play with d*ckheads. I mean, of course not playing with d*ckheads is a good idea, but people violate principles all the time, in all areas of life, without being fundamentally unworthy people. (My BW GM is one of the best GMs I've known.) And there are all sorts of ways we handle that short of ragequitting!</blockquote>

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