Teleport Circle - Destroyer of Worlds

[Lizard Lips]

Teleport Circle.... I hate it. A 17th level wizard can create a Teleport circle for a measly 1000 gp, and then make it permanant for 4500 xp (out of his 136,000 total).

This wizard can do this multiple times, and soon travel takes on a decidely Star Trek feel. No longer do people have to cross leagues to travel from city to city, no longer do caravans wind their way across the wilds, no longer do ships need to ply the dangerous seas. Just hop on the circle and blip, you're there. I suppose the common folk wouldn't be privy to such magic, but anyone who's willing to invest 1000 gp into their travel expenses will. Why buy even a single 30,000 gp ship (let alone a merchant fleet) when you can hire The Wizard to build you Teleport circles in all of your ports and transfer your goods quickly, cheaply, and without fear of them being destroyed in storms or taken by pirates. Pretty damn boring.

I know I could just take it out, and say Teleport Circles don't exist, but has anybody thought of a way where I can keep Teleoprt Circles (which can be cool, if used sparringly) but prevent them from warping the quasi medieval world of DnD into the Jetsons?

 

[Psion]

Teleport Circle.... I hate it. A 17th level wizard can create a Teleport circle for a measly 1000 gp, and then make it permanant for 4500 xp (out of his 136,000 total).

Whoa! Yoa say that like it was some mean feat.

First off, I must direct you to page 149 of the DMG for the proper rules on assessing NPC spellcasting cost. Even assuming you find a wizard willing and able to cast it, it will cost no less than 25880 gp!

Second, how many wizards are there in your campaign that are:
1) 17th level
2) Willing to give up 4500 xp (note that you cannot spend XP that would lower you a level... the wizard has to give up XP that would normally go towards advancement towards your next level. Not bloody likely that you will find one who will do so easily.)
3) Knows these exact two spells.

This wizard can do this multiple times,

Repeatedly surrender 4500 xp? Not bloody likely!

I suppose the common folk wouldn't be privy to such magic, but anyone who's willing to invest 1000 gp into their travel expenses will. Why buy even a single 30,000 gp ship

25880 for a one way trip. From one location, to one location.

(let alone a merchant fleet) when

IF

you can hire The Wizard to build you Teleport circles in all of your ports and transfer your goods quickly, cheaply,

*coff* Cheaply? Not.

I know I could just take it out, and say Teleport Circles don't exist, but has anybody thought of a way where I can keep Teleoprt Circles (which can be cool, if used sparringly) but prevent them from warping the quasi medieval world of DnD into the Jetsons?

For one, you can read the cost rules and stop being so generous with your assumptions.

Two, you can say a wizard will not willingly give up their XP without major compensation. You can use the power component rule, and require that the party aquire the rare component that they need as party of a difficult quest. One that NPCs will not be able to easily overcone. (Whatya mean I need the ichoor of 100 demons!)

Three, you can also make some realistic assumptions about the availability and cooperativeness of high level NPC spellcasters. You can make finding one that can and will help you a task unto itself.

 

[Tsyr]

This is one of the reasons I have other limiters on magic in my campagin... soft limits, but limits none the less.

For teleport, for example, you can teleport all you want... if you are willing to pay the price. Teleporting effects weather in the vicinity of both the teleport site and the destination. Many large cities have strict regulations on teleporting within a days hike from the city. It's safe enough it can be used in a pinch... you're never going to cause the next biblical-level flood or nothing, but you could hurt a growing season if you caused a drout or too much rain or something, or in the winter you could cause havoc with a blizzard. It's safe enough once and a while... But it's generaly not approved of.

 

[UD]

Nice idea Tysr, I agree with Psion, but your idea certanly adds flavour.

 

[Wolfspider]

Re: Re: Teleport Circle - Destroyer of Worlds

Good answer, Psion. A prefect solution to a problem that apparently never existed....

 

[Henry]

Lizard Lips,

(I never did meet anyone who ever asked to be called that before )

What you are describing here also goes for the 5th level teleport as well as all other 5th level + spells that offer instantaneous or near-instantaneous travel. These spells drastically change the nature of the campaign, and it is a part of D&D - it has been since 1978 (or even earlier).

A DM has to either remove these elements forcibly, or has to come to terms with them in the campaign, and make allowances for them - no adventures with tight timetables of travel, or none that prevent the PC's from going somewhere physically, forcing them to find some other way. By that level, the challenges of low-level adventurers are not suitable for high-level adventurers, anyway.

However, take what Psion said in mind. Teleport circle is no mere cantrip - it requires huge expenditures on the part of the wizard to make permanent.

 

[Tzarevitch]

Re: Re: Teleport Circle - Destroyer of Worlds

For one, you can read the cost rules and stop being so generous with your assumptions.

Two, you can say a wizard will not willingly give up their XP without major compensation. You can use the power component rule, and require that the party aquire the rare component that they need as party of a difficult quest. One that NPCs will not be able to easily overcone. (Whatya mean I need the ichoor of 100 demons!)

Three, you can also make some realistic assumptions about the availability and cooperativeness of high level NPC spellcasters. You can make finding one that can and will help you a task unto itself.

I go by the theory that teleport actually folds space between two locations by accessing the astral plane. There is a chance each time you teleport that the fold was unstable and it either dumps people on the astral plane or dumps astral creatures onto the Prime.

A permanent teleport circle has a 5% chance per 6 seconds that something from the astral plane breaches it and arrives on the Prime. Very likely anyone who sets up a permanent teleport circle will end up with a large force of demons or devils who stake a claim to the portal to use as their invasion beachhead.

Tzarevitch

 

[Tzarevitch]

Lizard Lips,

(I never did meet anyone who ever asked to be called that before )

What you are describing here also goes for the 5th level teleport as well as all other 5th level + spells that offer instantaneous or near-instantaneous travel. These spells drastically change the nature of the campaign, and it is a part of D&D - it has been since 1978 (or even earlier).

A DM has to either remove these elements forcibly, or has to come to terms with them in the campaign, and make allowances for them - no adventures with tight timetables of travel, or none that prevent the PC's from going somewhere physically, forcing them to find some other way. By that level, the challenges of low-level adventurers are not suitable for high-level adventurers, anyway.

However, take what Psion said in mind. Teleport circle is no mere cantrip - it requires huge expenditures on the part of the wizard to make permanent.

Actually, the requirements are trivial for a wizard of that level. The xp cost is tiny and you can recoup the fairly measly gp cost by renting the teleporter to a merchant house that needs to transport goods to that location anyway.

The wizard can recoup his losses in gp and make a fortune in the long term with tolls for the telporter's use and it is cheaper and safer for the merchant to pay the toll and send his goods this way rather than risk overland or oversea trave. You just set up at least one more of these to return and you are in business.

Tzarevitch

 

[Lizard Lips]

I know Teleport Circle has been in the game forever, and I know that DnD has been and always will be a game about Dungeon Crawls, where this sort of spell doesn't pose a problem. What bothers me is that I can't suspend my disbelief when it comes to NPCs using this. The DMG lists a sailing ship at 10,000 gp. Why would any merchant invest in purchasing sailing ships when he can simply hire a wizard to build him 2 Teleport Circles between two major ports? Why risk carting your preciuos Mithril or Gold or whatever down out of the Orc infested mountains when you can just build a Teleporter at the Mining camp and beam the stuff directly to the Kingdom's capitol.

As for the cost... have you seen the costs of some of the magic items in the DMG? Compared to that stuff a pair of teleporters is nothing. A ring of Protection +5 is 50,000 gp. That's great if you spend your life on the battlefield or delving into dungeons, but wouldn't it be safer and more proffitable to whip up a pair of Teleporters and make gobs off of charging people to use them?

I don't have so much of a problem with PCs using Teleport Circle, but in a world where you can build a chain of Teleporters, what happens to all the stock situations that we put our PCs through? The caravan that needs to be guarded, the pirates plundering ships laden with riches from distant continents, assassins who attack the King while he's en route to a peace summit, all the stuff that makes for good adventures? I guess some things wouldn't be worth it to set up Teleporters for... I can always have my PCs gaurd caravans of goats or ships laden with shrimp or something... it's just not the same.

 

[Zappo]

Uhm... I can't see a 17th level wizard tossing away 4500 XP for money. I can hardly imagine one willing to do that multiple times. Very unlikely.

That said... if I owned a travel company and someone came to me with this idea I would ROTFLMAO and then tell them to go to all my concurrents and try to sell it to them.
That way, I can pay a 5th level wizard to go to their circle by night and cast a dozen Dispel Magic.It takes an 18 on the roll for the 5th level wizard to take down the Teleportation Circle... 15% chance. Tell him to go there invisible every night until he gets it right. Buy scrolls, or a higher-level wizard if you are impatient.

It cannot work. 90% of the magical civil engineering tricks cannot work. First of all, Dispel Magic tears them down easily, and you can even cast it while invisible. Secondly, many of them require XP, and XP don't grow on trees (unless you like shooting elves, that is).

So... if you have a player who is attempting to get rich this way, have him make his teleport circle spending 28000+ GP, run it for two days - the time for the other merchants to agree on what to do - and then dispel it.