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<blockquote data-quote="DSC-EricPrice" data-source="post: 2059368" data-attributes="member: 2110">Quite the contrary I thought my post made it clear that we though shapeshifting and / or wildshaping into a form the same size as your original form and then becoming the subject of a animal growth would be perfectly ok. What we objected to was wildshaping into a different SIZED animal (which is both a form change AND a size change), such as my favorite the gargantuan dire elephant, and THEN trying to apply the effects of the animal growth spell. I'm perfectly willing to admit we erred in deciding so, but I would prefer if there was an errata or some other rules clarification that indicated so. G-d knows it wouldnt be the first time I made a mistake (obviously, I looked right past the celestial charger) but I still maintain I'd kill my DM if he summoned me a grig as part of a 9th level spell. Given the DC is 12 IIRC I doubt anything that my 17th+ level druid is fighting is going to have a difficult time making the save... Honestly though even if WotC came out and said they intended for it to be used this way we'd house rule it for exactly the reasons that have come up on this thread. It pushes the envelope too far.Id also be curious what makes you think a natural animal would not die? Not being celestial or fiendish and thus not having a planar background, i can think of no reason that an ordinary animal summoned with the spell wouldnt die when killed.As for 9th level SNA - The pixie on the other hand might be ok with his sleep arrows, assuming he can hit what im fighting and they have low will saves, but in the end, in all the times Ive played druids, its never worked out in my advantage to use SNA as a 9th level spell. <img src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/joypixels/assets/8.0/png/unicode/64/1f641.png" class="smilie smilie--emoji" loading="lazy" width="64" height="64" alt=":(" title="Frown&nbsp; &nbsp; :("&nbsp; data-smilie="3"data-shortname=":(" /> YMMV</blockquote>

[QUOTE="DSC-EricPrice, post: 2059368, member: 2110"] Quite the contrary I thought my post made it clear that we though shapeshifting and / or wildshaping into a form the same size as your original form and then becoming the subject of a animal growth would be perfectly ok. What we objected to was wildshaping into a different SIZED animal (which is both a form change AND a size change), such as my favorite the gargantuan dire elephant, and THEN trying to apply the effects of the animal growth spell. I'm perfectly willing to admit we erred in deciding so, but I would prefer if there was an errata or some other rules clarification that indicated so. G-d knows it wouldnt be the first time I made a mistake (obviously, I looked right past the celestial charger) but I still maintain I'd kill my DM if he summoned me a grig as part of a 9th level spell. Given the DC is 12 IIRC I doubt anything that my 17th+ level druid is fighting is going to have a difficult time making the save... Honestly though even if WotC came out and said they intended for it to be used this way we'd house rule it for exactly the reasons that have come up on this thread. It pushes the envelope too far. Id also be curious what makes you think a natural animal would not die? Not being celestial or fiendish and thus not having a planar background, i can think of no reason that an ordinary animal summoned with the spell wouldnt die when killed. As for 9th level SNA - The pixie on the other hand might be ok with his sleep arrows, assuming he can hit what im fighting and they have low will saves, but in the end, in all the times Ive played druids, its never worked out in my advantage to use SNA as a 9th level spell. :( YMMV [/QUOTE]

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