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Message: <blockquote data-quote="JEB" data-source="post: 9293525" data-attributes="member: 10148">OK, moving on from Basic D&D, let's look at 1e! More specifically, the original Monster Manual.There are 43 monsters listed from the 1e MM that have never been core again - honestly a lot more than I expected.<ul> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Cerebral parasite</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Floating eye</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Larva</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Masher</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Wind walker</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Hippopotamus</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Giant turtle: sea and snapping</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Giant beaver, giant ram, giant stag, giant Portuguese man-o-war</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Baluchitherium, Irish deer, woolly rhinoceros, titanothere</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Tiamat and Bahamut</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Demon lords: Demogorgon, Juiblex, Yeenoghu</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Archdevils: Asmodeus, Baalzebul, Dispater, Geryon</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">A bunch of dinosaurs: anatosaurus (trachodon), apatosaurus (brontosaurus), archelon (ischyras), brachiosaurus, camarasaurus, ceratosaurus, cetiosaurus, dinichtys, gorgosaurus, iguanodon, megalosaurus, monoclonius, mosasaurus, paleoscincus (paleocinthus), pentaceratops, plateosaurus, styracosaurus, and teratosaurus.</li> </ul>Why were these included? The likely reason for most is boring: because they were already in 0e, whether from supplements or The Strategic Review/Dragon. But there are some that were completely new, like the Archdevils and many of the dinosaurs. The former were presumably there to contrast with the Demon Lords... but the dinosaurs, who knows? (Maybe Gygax just liked dinosaurs; he also put a bunch in MM II.)Why didn't these return to the core? That's a better question, particularly for 2e. Certainly I could see them making cuts from the 1e core in MC Vol. 1 and 2, to make room for Fiend Folio and MM II highlights. But why these? And why didn't the Monstrous Manual bring them back? (Many did finally return in 2e's MC Annual 2, FWIW; some of the dinosaurs even earlier, in the Forgotten Realms MC Appendix.)Throwing a few guesses out there:<ul> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Floating eye, masher, etc.: Bias against aquatic monsters, as suggested by [USER=7635]@Remathilis[/USER]</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Unique monsters: Just a philosophical decision that they don't belong in the general monster listing (2e, 3e, and 5e agreed on this, but 4e was the exception)</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Dinosaurs: Just too many of them! (Contrast this also with Basic using generic templates for their core dinosaurs.)</li> </ul>Curious to hear everyone else's thoughts! Or just wax rhapsodic about your favorites of this set. (I have a soft spot for the floating eye, myself.)</blockquote>

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