Upgrade your account to a Community Supporter account and remove most of the site ads.

Reply to thread

Message: <blockquote data-quote="BSF" data-source="post: 1472865" data-attributes="member: 13098">Whoa!  One of my first, deep discussions here on EN World involved you and woodelf.  I was almost sure you were advocating that the newer versions of DnD were restrictive on the RP side because of the implied restrictions.  IIRC - Things like certain actions are implied to not be doable because of the nature of feats.  Since Feats "break the rules", if there isn't a feat to do X,Y or Z, then it must not be possible.  I remember this conversation so well because it really made me stop and think how my players might see it from their side of the field.  Unless I communicate that this implied nature doesn't necessarily exist, how will they know that I might allow it?  But really, I don't think this is what you are talking about in this discussion. I think the issue is that the Core rules are relatively light on "flavor".  They provide just enough flavor to allow you to play the game and have a cleric, or to have a gnome, or whatever.  This is what new players are being introduced to if they pick up the books and read.  The reason a lot of people like Forgotten Realms is because it has deep "flavor" presented in books that are readily accessible.  (As accessible as books in our hobby get at least.)  This means you have more flavor, you have books that you can point your players at, and everyone will accept it as canon.  However, I have my own campaign world.  And there are no books for the players to read to learn all about it.  I am sure it is sometimes frustrating for them, but they also seem to enjoy the game.  The previous campaign has become a significant portion of history.  They like that.  They understand that there are no dwarves.  They realize that elves are different.  They know that I might not accept anything that they want to bring in.  Or I might, they should talk to me about it.  I do have a fair amount of trust with my players, but I have earned it.  Then, having an established game, it is easier for new players to share some of that trust.  To be honest, it sounds like you are dealing with bad players.  The system isn't the problem, but it might contribute to the symptoms.  Some players will look at the system and decide that any game should be open, simply because the system is designed with some openess.  To put it another way:  Just because HERO is point buy and can be used in any environment does not give a player the flexibility to make a spell-casting mage for a cyberpunk style campaign.  By the same token, just because the Iron Monks of the Burning Lung* exist in a splatbook, does not mean you can play one in my game.  If you have players that cannot accept these "flavor" restrictions, it is because of the person, not the system.  But, they will fall back to the system to support their perspective.  I'm sorry you have gone through burnout.  But, if it helps,you have offered good advice to me in the past and it doesn't sound like you are a "bad" GM.  You just might be having a string of "bad" player experiences.*Iron Monks of the Burning Lung do not, as far as I know, exist.  But, if they did, I expect that high levels of the PrC would grant some sort of wacky DR and probably fire breathing.  Heck, maybe even Energy Resistance against fire.  Hence, they are very attractive to a player, but probably unbalanced.  Hmm, I wonder if I could make a PrC like that and keep it balanced?</blockquote>

Verification