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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Cheiromancer" data-source="post: 3765563" data-attributes="member: 141">If something is true by definition it is true by virtue of its meaning, and this holds in all possible worlds.  It is a priori and necessary.  Something which is a priori and contingent can't be true by definition.I was hoping for positive arguments for subjective morality. <img src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/joypixels/assets/8.0/png/unicode/64/1f641.png" class="smilie smilie--emoji" loading="lazy" width="64" height="64" alt=":(" title="Frown    :("  data-smilie="3"data-shortname=":(" />  If you listen to arguments *against* positions you end up disbelieving in other minds, the existence of an external world, etc..  Pragmatic difficulties ensue. <img src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/joypixels/assets/8.0/png/unicode/64/1f609.png" class="smilie smilie--emoji" loading="lazy" width="64" height="64" alt=";)" title="Wink    ;)"  data-smilie="2"data-shortname=";)" />You don't write like an amateur.  What's your philosophical training?  I have an MA and a few years teaching experience.  And an M.Div.editAnd before that, a B.Sc. in Mathematics.  Which occasionally flavors my philosophical positions.  For instance, I tend to regard statements as relative to their background assumptions... but then I turn around and consider them as absolute, given their background assumptions.  Whether or not a particular position in Chess contains a winning move for White is a fact.  Even though Chess is ultimately dependent on human minds.In this case it means that if there are norms governing intelligent social behavior, then subjective morality grounded in those norms may be construed as objective, given those norms.  I think this could be grounded in an evolutionary description of morality.  The kernel would be that genes have an obligation to replicate.  Then add enough game theory to support a theory of altruism (which is kinda necessary to have multicellular organisms, let alone social organisms) and you are off to the races.  Evil behavior contradicts more sophisticated game theoretical rules, in the same way that selfish behavior is a losing strategy in an indefinitely repeated Prisoner's Dilemma.Except it is not really evil in the absence of consciousness, is it?  So there needs to be an explanation about why consciousness ought to classify things into categories of "is" and "ought" - what survival benefit would this bring?I think it is very difficult to put these arguments together, but I don't see any reason why it couldn't be done.</blockquote>

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