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<blockquote data-quote="Bastoche" data-source="post: 4033053" data-attributes="member: 306">My argument is that in sim game, the emphasis in placed upon exploration (of character, system or universe). What I call &quot;theme&quot; is not what would be called &quot;genre&quot; in sim play (so-called &quot;high concept&quot;).My &quot;Y&quot; example would be better explained via an example game. Let's take dogs in the vineyard. In the game, the PCs are holy gunslingers who brings justice by fighting evil. The game takes place in what is called a &quot;town&quot;. There is some people doing bad things in the town which draw God's wrath. For example, crops are dying because some people are doing bad things. When the town event is resolved, the PCs have fought the evil and crops grow again. What the game goal is about is at what cost did that evil was fought? The town will forever be changed from the coming of the dogs (the holy gunslingers) for good or ill, most often ill. Fighting evil comes with a price and what the game is about.In a sim game, you may still have dogs and town with evil etc. However, the goal of the game is not fighting evil per se. It may be the in-game goals of the characters but it's not the goal of the game itself. It could just be &quot;Let's play in that setting to see what happens?&quot;What I'm saying too is that if you want to explore a &quot;theme&quot; (not as in &quot;genre&quot; but as in &quot;premise&quot;), if it's not hardwired into the rules, you cannot know if the theme will be explored or not whereas in nar game, you make it happen. You can say a sim bunch of players make sure theme and premise adressing is happening to which I say it's not playing sim.Another way to put it is that to &quot;hardcore&quot; sim players, if no theme is adressed, the game is still fun (assuming the &quot;sim&quot; part is fullfilled in play) while it's boring to nar players.</blockquote>

[QUOTE="Bastoche, post: 4033053, member: 306"] My argument is that in sim game, the emphasis in placed upon exploration (of character, system or universe). What I call "theme" is not what would be called "genre" in sim play (so-called "high concept"). My "Y" example would be better explained via an example game. Let's take dogs in the vineyard. In the game, the PCs are holy gunslingers who brings justice by fighting evil. The game takes place in what is called a "town". There is some people doing bad things in the town which draw God's wrath. For example, crops are dying because some people are doing bad things. When the town event is resolved, the PCs have fought the evil and crops grow again. What the game goal is about is at what cost did that evil was fought? The town will forever be changed from the coming of the dogs (the holy gunslingers) for good or ill, most often ill. Fighting evil comes with a price and what the game is about. In a sim game, you may still have dogs and town with evil etc. However, the goal of the game is not fighting evil per se. It may be the in-game goals of the characters but it's not the goal of the game itself. It could just be "Let's play in that setting to see what happens?" What I'm saying too is that if you want to explore a "theme" (not as in "genre" but as in "premise"), if it's not hardwired into the rules, you cannot know if the theme will be explored or not whereas in nar game, you make it happen. You can say a sim bunch of players make sure theme and premise adressing is happening to which I say it's not playing sim. Another way to put it is that to "hardcore" sim players, if no theme is adressed, the game is still fun (assuming the "sim" part is fullfilled in play) while it's boring to nar players. [/QUOTE]

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