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<blockquote data-quote="aramis erak" data-source="post: 8667725" data-attributes="member: 6779310"><p>I can honestly say that I NEVER encountered any of your "Old School" types until the 1990's. </p><p></p><p>I know they existed, but for many, Old School RPGing was borderline boardgaming or were explicitly minis wargaming. Including D&D, AD&D1E, Star Frontiers, Marvel Super Heroes, and some of the adventures for Traveller, WFRP 1E...</p><p>We were never about "reading the GM"... we were about the push your luck and accomplish the module goal, within the resource limits.</p><p></p><p>We had story emerge, but the game was the key element, not the story. Personal bragging factor.</p><p></p><p>So, at best, it's a misnamed category. A category that will lead people to misunderstand other uses of the same label, because it's incongruent with that common lable and with the actual what was played back in the day. (I've limited my own "old school" to about 1984 and before - the point where skill based games were now dominating the non-D&D market, and D&D was introducing NWPs.)</p><p></p><p>The Free Kriegspiel style has been around a long time (1890's) in wargaming, but it was never dominant in wargaming outside the military, and it's looks to have never been the dominant mode in RPGing, at least not post 1976. It's a niche, an artefact that is much touted as having been prominent in "the good old days" but there's not enough evidence for that to have been true. (It's explicit that Kriegspiel was an influence on Weseley and Arneson, hence Braunstein, and eventually D&D. I don't recall mention of Frei Kriegspiel by either. Likewise, Ken St. Andre has implied being familiar with KS, but hasn't mentioned FKS.)</p><p></p><p>Note also: Frie Kreegspiel has had a revival growing out of the OSR - the OSR being another case where claims of uniformity in the past are 90% rose colored view. It's a perfectly valid mode of play... but the reactions to the rules back in the day were far from unified, and those who came to the game without being a player in someone else's game might be playing VERY differently.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="aramis erak, post: 8667725, member: 6779310"] I can honestly say that I NEVER encountered any of your "Old School" types until the 1990's. I know they existed, but for many, Old School RPGing was borderline boardgaming or were explicitly minis wargaming. Including D&D, AD&D1E, Star Frontiers, Marvel Super Heroes, and some of the adventures for Traveller, WFRP 1E... We were never about "reading the GM"... we were about the push your luck and accomplish the module goal, within the resource limits. We had story emerge, but the game was the key element, not the story. Personal bragging factor. So, at best, it's a misnamed category. A category that will lead people to misunderstand other uses of the same label, because it's incongruent with that common lable and with the actual what was played back in the day. (I've limited my own "old school" to about 1984 and before - the point where skill based games were now dominating the non-D&D market, and D&D was introducing NWPs.) The Free Kriegspiel style has been around a long time (1890's) in wargaming, but it was never dominant in wargaming outside the military, and it's looks to have never been the dominant mode in RPGing, at least not post 1976. It's a niche, an artefact that is much touted as having been prominent in "the good old days" but there's not enough evidence for that to have been true. (It's explicit that Kriegspiel was an influence on Weseley and Arneson, hence Braunstein, and eventually D&D. I don't recall mention of Frei Kriegspiel by either. Likewise, Ken St. Andre has implied being familiar with KS, but hasn't mentioned FKS.) Note also: Frie Kreegspiel has had a revival growing out of the OSR - the OSR being another case where claims of uniformity in the past are 90% rose colored view. It's a perfectly valid mode of play... but the reactions to the rules back in the day were far from unified, and those who came to the game without being a player in someone else's game might be playing VERY differently. [/QUOTE]
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