Upgrade your account to a Community Supporter account and remove most of the site ads.

Reply to thread

Message: <blockquote data-quote="Aegeri" data-source="post: 5255895" data-attributes="member: 78116">It's how future classes - not the old ones - will be designed that will matter here. While I like alternative class structures - I am a fan of both the mage and the domain cleric they've presented - I don't like it being too whacky. Too whacky produces unpredictable results at times (EG psionic classes that use PPs). At the same time there is good whacky, like the Monk who is an interesting and fun class to play - yet has quite a different interpretation on the power system.Change is a very good thing, but sometimes it can also be absolutely terrible for the game as psionics shows us. I feel massive changes like this fighter design, given such things are informing how later classes will be designed I feel deserve something to put it all in context. Reading this, I'm very leery of it being either completely useless or somehow exploitable with existing classes to be potentially game breaking.I'd just like to think we don't get carried away with essentials and future classes, throwing the baby out with the bath water entirely. It is telling to me that the three power point using psionic classes are the worst balanced in 4E at the moment. There is good logic behind the systems use of at-will/encounter/daily powers for everyone. When it's changed I'd really like to see more how it fits together, so we don't end up with another Psion (Mind Thrust + Dishearten for thirty levels... GO). Poor at low levels and absolutely game breaking by epic when their scaling mods break over the +7 range.Otherwise we'll all be back here in sixth months arguing about all the errata to books again.Edit: I understand your point, I really do. But you need to understand my point that we're looking at the future of how 4E will be designed. I like new options even if I don't even play 4E, but I do run three campaigns. New options mean new player character concepts and builds, which make different monsters more interesting and such forth. This is a great thing. At the same time, I'm not so keen on entirely abandoning core parts of the system to do it (encounter/daily powers). I like the mage and cleric, because they change things around but keep a familiar enough structure. The knight changes everything around and I'm really unconvinced it's for the best.For the most part, 4E has pretty solid balance between its classes with some spikes and some dips. In general though there isn't a single class that is nonviable and I've ceased micromanging any class in 4E. I let people play what they want and the system 90% of the time takes good care of them - without my micromanagement of powers/feats except in rare cases. That's a true triumph as a system, at least until Psionics was released in PHB3. Right now any Psionic class that gets a single low level at-will power that scales poorly (EG Lightning Rush and Mind Thrust) becomes far more powerful or even game breaking by epic. This is because the power point system is deeply, chronically flawed and doesn't work. For the first and only time in 4E, I've had to micromanage three classes and think about rewriting for myself an entire system (Power Points) to bring spamming of low level "at-will" augment 2s down by epic tier.It's not my idea of fun and not why I enjoy 4E.I will keep ragging on Psionics all the time until I get my point across. Psionics are broken because they completely dismantled part of the encounter/daily system for them. At low levels they perform okay, but once they get the PP to turn an encounter power into an at-will some become broken or far more effective than if they take a higher level power (Battleminds with Lightning Rush for example, is a night and day difference as a defender). They weren't successful the first time they abandoned the set encounter and daily system all classes share. I need to be convinced when I see classes like this that also abandon the encounter and daily system it isn't another Psionics level mistake. You can say I might be "upset" here, but I'm more just very cautious and really wanting to see a lot more information to be convinced this is a good idea.</blockquote>

Verification