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Message: <blockquote data-quote="ECMO3" data-source="post: 9182875" data-attributes="member: 7030563">The subclasses released for fighters have been pretty powerful, especially at most levels where the game is played.  Enough so that fighters, playing a powerful fighter class, are generally ahead of Wizards, Sorcerers and Bards in tier 1 and roughly equivalent to them and other full casters in the first half of tier 2.This may be an argument that is true for Barbarians and Monks, but if you pick the better subclasses it is not generally true for fighters except at relatively high levels.I think the lions share of  the design for PCs since the PHB is in the subclasses, not in the spells and if you look at the number of pages devoted to spells vs subclasses in the tomes published since then, I think that will proven out, and I don't think martials are generally lacking there.People repeat the same old arguments to support their position even when those arguments are no longer true and have not been true for several years.Battlemaster maneuvers are available to EVERY fighter.  Not only one subclass! Every single fighter has access to battlemaster maneuvers at 1st level, before they even choose a subclass. It is a core part of the fighter CLASS design now, and has been since Tasha's was published.Every fighter I have played in the last 2 years has had battlemaster maneuvers.  Every single one, and I have not played a single fighter with the Battlemaster subclass in that timeframe.</blockquote>

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