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Message: <blockquote data-quote="I'm A Banana" data-source="post: 3202549" data-attributes="member: 2067">Not in any D&D I've ever played. The PHB doesn't once mention with clear definition where the source of any magic comes from. I believe this is intentional, to make for multiple possible definitions.Yes or No answers are still vaguely interpreted, and are not eternal. Furthermore, I may just reach an agent of my deity. In addition, Commune, being a 5th level spell, is out of the realm of experience of most believers in the religion, who are rarely exposed to anything above 2nd-level magic. While those in some civilized lands may have clerics who have done this, it is hardly the trump card you seem to think it is.One can have a Lawful revolution, a Lawful change, and a Lawful rebellion. It needs to be ordered, to respect legitimate authority, and to consider general principle over specific individuality. Why would my Paladin lose his powers? Unless you're trying to define the code in such a stringent way that make it inevitable that any Paladin with a disagreement in his order is condemned to forever be a fighter without feats.So? That proves that paladins can't validly honor a deity that expressly permits lawful and good behavior....how?There's a great continuum between "some hillbilly LG Wee Jas church in the hinterlands has some paladins who think the rest of the church is wrong" and holy war. The LG church, by the RAW, is *still* the minority. Whatever they advocte, they don't have the leverage to pull it off...though they may someday dream that they will.This fits in with the overall playing of paladins perfectly. No matter how many criminals they bring to justice, there will always be more. The dream is that someday the ideas and examples will be powerful enough to sway minds. Yes, but just because she says so now doesn't mean she might not change her mind. Or that her true feelings are being represented (remember the line for "an agent" of the deity -- it's reasonable that all those Yes answers were given by a group of devils who serve as agents). Doctrines change with time, with new information, and with new leadership, and any LG priest or paladin is well within the scope of rationality to hope and work for such a day to come. Just as any LE cleric is well within the scope of rationality to believe that someday the whole church may bow to him (or his puppet-governor). The only thing that a cleric can say with certainty in the RAW is that the LE cleric believes he's right and still casts spells. And the Wee Jasian paladin would note this, and fight against it (using the Law to trap him, for instance, even if it takes years of studying his every move. Or encouraging a sect to develop that opposes his ideas, all the while obeying Jasian Law).</blockquote>

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