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<blockquote data-quote="Levistus's_Leviathan" data-source="post: 8411808" data-attributes="member: 7023887"><p>Sure, but you can also lean into the esoteric nature of the class without having to base it so much after East Asian exotica. "Esoteric" doesn't always mean "East Asian themed". You could have an Esoteric Pugilist, that is just a wrestler/boxer that punches people magically. There's no reason why that has to automatically be based off of East Asian Monks. It can obviously fulfill that theme, and like I said before, I love that D&D can support a diverse array of playstyles and characters, but I don't think it's good class design to have one of the core classes of the game be so heavily based off of a real world culture. I don't like it with Paladins, Barbarians, or Druids, and I don't like it with Monks. </p><p></p><p>. . . It makes it less of a Samurai than the Samurai subclass. <a href="https://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0209.html" target="_blank">There's an Order of the Stick comic precisely about this</a>. If there's an archetype named something and you call yourself that thing, it will make people confused and you'll be perceived as less of that thing than the person of that archetype.</p><p></p><p>Swashbuckling is a much larger and less specific theme than a Samurai, which is a very specific real world culture's type of warrior. This is a false equivalency. </p><p></p><p>It's not about "grid filling". It's about "why are we treating these types of real world culture's specialized warriors differently?" IMHO, they should all be treated the same; just being a specific way you play your character. If one is a subclass and another is just reflavoring, they're not being treated in the same way, and this causes issues and questions about why it is the way it is. It's favoritism and nonsensical design. I like design, worldbuilding, and homebrewing that makes sense.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Levistus's_Leviathan, post: 8411808, member: 7023887"] Sure, but you can also lean into the esoteric nature of the class without having to base it so much after East Asian exotica. "Esoteric" doesn't always mean "East Asian themed". You could have an Esoteric Pugilist, that is just a wrestler/boxer that punches people magically. There's no reason why that has to automatically be based off of East Asian Monks. It can obviously fulfill that theme, and like I said before, I love that D&D can support a diverse array of playstyles and characters, but I don't think it's good class design to have one of the core classes of the game be so heavily based off of a real world culture. I don't like it with Paladins, Barbarians, or Druids, and I don't like it with Monks. . . . It makes it less of a Samurai than the Samurai subclass. [URL='https://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0209.html']There's an Order of the Stick comic precisely about this[/URL]. If there's an archetype named something and you call yourself that thing, it will make people confused and you'll be perceived as less of that thing than the person of that archetype. Swashbuckling is a much larger and less specific theme than a Samurai, which is a very specific real world culture's type of warrior. This is a false equivalency. It's not about "grid filling". It's about "why are we treating these types of real world culture's specialized warriors differently?" IMHO, they should all be treated the same; just being a specific way you play your character. If one is a subclass and another is just reflavoring, they're not being treated in the same way, and this causes issues and questions about why it is the way it is. It's favoritism and nonsensical design. I like design, worldbuilding, and homebrewing that makes sense. [/QUOTE]
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