Reply to thread

Message

<blockquote data-quote="Victim" data-source="post: 177671" data-attributes="member: 78">With a bit of teamwork and preparation, you can get almost the same effects without a single (permanent) magic item.&nbsp; Mass Haste, extended Magic Vestments, etc.&nbsp; With no magic items, that cleric will have a +4 Plate, a +4 shield and maybe a +4 weapon that will last all day from extend spell.&nbsp; Standard AC is still 27, with 31 self buffed and 35 if the wizard hastes him.&nbsp; And now the fighter is screwed because his gear sucks in comparison and the cleric had to use too many spells to keep up his own defenses to buff him too.&nbsp; The only way to prevent this effect is rip apart the spellcasting classes.&nbsp;&nbsp; A lower tech setting probably won't have anywhere near as much masterwork stuff, so while so knock about 5 off the heroes AC because he's in hide, you knock 2 off the attack of the guard so things aren't much better.&nbsp; Of course, you can benefit from higher dex with Hide, so there's barely any difference.Armor as DR would probably end up making goons with X-bows less efffective.&nbsp; Because these guys aren't going to be throwing attacks with good damage modifiers - they only do 1d8 with that crossbow - attacks will just bounce off the armor.&nbsp; After a certain point, you might not even bother rolling because their maximum damage is less than the DR with the exception of crits.&nbsp; And if you're giving an AC bonus, then they have a poor confirmation roll.&nbsp; 10th level characters will still be invulnerable to loser guards with crossbows.&nbsp; Problem not solved.By this point, you've gone from a advocating a change from ablaitive style to defenses (getting worn down) to more absolute defenses (not hit as often, but it hurts more) to completely redesigning spell casting classes and spell lists, changing armor to DR, removing magic items and high middle ages technology, and adding another class ability for balancing.&nbsp; That's hardly getting the same result &quot;just as easily.&quot;</blockquote>

[QUOTE="Victim, post: 177671, member: 78"] With a bit of teamwork and preparation, you can get almost the same effects without a single (permanent) magic item. Mass Haste, extended Magic Vestments, etc. With no magic items, that cleric will have a +4 Plate, a +4 shield and maybe a +4 weapon that will last all day from extend spell. Standard AC is still 27, with 31 self buffed and 35 if the wizard hastes him. And now the fighter is screwed because his gear sucks in comparison and the cleric had to use too many spells to keep up his own defenses to buff him too. The only way to prevent this effect is rip apart the spellcasting classes. A lower tech setting probably won't have anywhere near as much masterwork stuff, so while so knock about 5 off the heroes AC because he's in hide, you knock 2 off the attack of the guard so things aren't much better. Of course, you can benefit from higher dex with Hide, so there's barely any difference. Armor as DR would probably end up making goons with X-bows less efffective. Because these guys aren't going to be throwing attacks with good damage modifiers - they only do 1d8 with that crossbow - attacks will just bounce off the armor. After a certain point, you might not even bother rolling because their maximum damage is less than the DR with the exception of crits. And if you're giving an AC bonus, then they have a poor confirmation roll. 10th level characters will still be invulnerable to loser guards with crossbows. Problem not solved. By this point, you've gone from a advocating a change from ablaitive style to defenses (getting worn down) to more absolute defenses (not hit as often, but it hurts more) to completely redesigning spell casting classes and spell lists, changing armor to DR, removing magic items and high middle ages technology, and adding another class ability for balancing. That's hardly getting the same result "just as easily." [/QUOTE]

Verification