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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Barastrondo" data-source="post: 5733017" data-attributes="member: 3820">I've got no problems with both "good" societies and more morally nuanced societies coexisting, even in the same D&D world. It depends on what the individual game's about. Probably the best argument for the "good" society for those of us who enjoy them in some of our games is not necessarily defending the status quo, but improving it -- making things better for the people who are basically decent at heart, driving out corruption, and generally putting your stamp on the world in a positive way. Here I look less to Tolkien (though his stuff is relevant) and more to the overall drive of Arthur in T.H. White. It's a noble dream to provide an example, and when you add in the "slay evils" aspect of it, it's eminently gameable. On the other hand, I have a lot of use for amoral settings where a society is complicated and largely driven by self-interest; those further a certain roguish sort of play that's also entertaining. They also don't require players with a "slay evil" mindset to give up on that; Renaissance Italy doesn't have to be a good-aligned society for you to still set some adventures around killing off Borgias. Probably my only requirement is that there not be a basis of "good" or "evil" based on character appearance alone. Sure, I like to use orcs and elves in a D&D game; they're easily understandable and relatable for my players, quick communication. But I want elves to be as morally complicated as humans, with their "good" societies and their amoral societies and their wicked, corrup, Melnibonean-ish societies, and I don't want players to be able to tell which elf is from which by their skin color. Similarly, I don't want orcs to be uniformly kill-on-sight permissible based on circumstance of birth; there are more outrageously supernatural threats available for that. It's more interesting to me to create a clearly cruel and rapacious culture, and have that be the focal point of opposition. The Ossenlander orcs are potential trouble, but they pale next to the murderous theocrats of Zagash, and so on.Variety for me, please. I like a D&D philosophy that can embrace all of this stuff, even in the same world, and make it work.</blockquote>

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