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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Zardnaar" data-source="post: 9771466" data-attributes="member: 6716779">Except vs low CR mooks theyre failing saves 75-95% of the time just like 3E.  You gave hypnotic pattern, fear, slow trifecta.  Druid emanating, cleric emanating, Bards can steal them and Warlocks it depends.  My party in dealing with are warlock, glanour bard, light cleric and sorcerer.  Any mook fight is irrelevant they have fireball but they have spirit guardians,  radiance of the dawn, Hypnotic  pattern, Synaptic  static, fear, summons, hunger of hadar etc. And the alert feat.  Smaller group's have to dodge command, slow,  Chromatic Orb, hold spells etc.  They have used fireball its been really good maybe twice 3 times max. 3.5 fireball was way better than 5E. Look at the amount of hp creatures had. Even better 3.0 less hp than 3.5. 10d6 often 15d6 via empower.  If 5E had a fireball  that in effect dealt 30d6 or 45d6 damage  which is an equivalent 3.5 fireball....5E hp bliat is generally double or triple 3.5. Fireball wasn't ideal in 3.5. It was still better than 5E. A weak 3.5 fireball cast at 5th level is still the equivalent of 10d6 in 5E or more. Dead is still a good debuff after all.4HD ogre AD&D. Fireballs a save or die3.5. Can still do it espicially  empowered. 5E ogre better roll high it probably  flunked both saves but survives 2 fireballs Low CR critters are surviving 18d6 damage double taps in 5E (upcast fireball+synaptic static). After flunking both saves. 2 3.6 fireballs 20d6 flunked saves i woukd gave to go check the book but you're probably looking at CR8s dead depending on crotter. And those 10d6 ones are more likely 25-30d6 (one 5th level slot plus third level slot same as 5E). Assuming they can't empower it for free (its 3.5 it happens). And fireball was "weak" in 3.5.</blockquote>

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