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<blockquote data-quote="Charlaquin" data-source="post: 7553346" data-attributes="member: 6779196"><p>No, I recognize the disagreement, it’s a big part of our larger disagreement. The thing is though, if you roll a 2, you objectively could have done better. There are 18 numbers you could have rolled and done better. So any interpretation of what a die roll represents that doesn’t acknowledge the fact that, no, a 2 is not the best you could have done, is not one I can agree with.</p><p></p><p></p><p>You’re establishing the cost or consequence for failure (in the tree example, the consequence is that it takes the established amount of time if you fail), making that cost or consequence clear to the player, and letting them decide if they want to roll or not. In situations you deem “not a challenge,” or as I would put it, action’s with no cost or consequence for failure, you simply narrate the results of the action without rolling any dice. This is literally exactly what I do, you just seem to dislike the way I frame it.</p><p></p><p></p><p>And when picking a lock, you’re moving a metal tool in a precise manner, in a pass:fail binary, you can’t pick the lock more or less, just pick it or fail. By what criteria is shooting a basket ball like an attack roll that picking a lock is not?</p><p></p><p> </p><p>And the conversation has evolved since then. In particular, I’ve now learned that you draw a distinction between challenges and actions that are not challenging (and therefore should not be rolled for). Having learned this, I have come to the hypothesis that there is no situation that you would deem “a challenge” that I would say does not have a cost or consequence, and am asking for an example of a task that does not have time pressure, that you would deem challenging enough to warrant a roll, in order to test this hypothesis.</p><p></p><p></p><p>Is it? I’m not convinced that it is. I think something about the way I am expressing my point is giving you the wrong idea about what play at my table actually looks like, and that what we each actually do is, while not identical, very similar.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Charlaquin, post: 7553346, member: 6779196"] No, I recognize the disagreement, it’s a big part of our larger disagreement. The thing is though, if you roll a 2, you objectively could have done better. There are 18 numbers you could have rolled and done better. So any interpretation of what a die roll represents that doesn’t acknowledge the fact that, no, a 2 is not the best you could have done, is not one I can agree with. You’re establishing the cost or consequence for failure (in the tree example, the consequence is that it takes the established amount of time if you fail), making that cost or consequence clear to the player, and letting them decide if they want to roll or not. In situations you deem “not a challenge,” or as I would put it, action’s with no cost or consequence for failure, you simply narrate the results of the action without rolling any dice. This is literally exactly what I do, you just seem to dislike the way I frame it. And when picking a lock, you’re moving a metal tool in a precise manner, in a pass:fail binary, you can’t pick the lock more or less, just pick it or fail. By what criteria is shooting a basket ball like an attack roll that picking a lock is not? And the conversation has evolved since then. In particular, I’ve now learned that you draw a distinction between challenges and actions that are not challenging (and therefore should not be rolled for). Having learned this, I have come to the hypothesis that there is no situation that you would deem “a challenge” that I would say does not have a cost or consequence, and am asking for an example of a task that does not have time pressure, that you would deem challenging enough to warrant a roll, in order to test this hypothesis. Is it? I’m not convinced that it is. I think something about the way I am expressing my point is giving you the wrong idea about what play at my table actually looks like, and that what we each actually do is, while not identical, very similar. [/QUOTE]
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