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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Imaro" data-source="post: 4687042" data-attributes="member: 48965">Just so you can follow what was posted and what is being argued... I have seen quite a few proponents for 4e claim that this exact method is how 4e handles skills that are not listed in the gamebooks... I am arguing it is not how 4e officially handles PC's having skills that are not in the book, plain and simple it is a houserule.  You seem to be arguing that it gives rules for ad-hoc actions... again, not what I am arguing against.  Now that that is clear I will respond to your post... No, the rules as stated above in the post I was arguing against is not a rule in 4e... you are showing something totally different than what Thasmodius stated was the way they were handled in 4e.  As far as the merits, I started discussing them because they are not the same thing as stated above, and was trying to, perhaps poorly, show you that.  I never said 4e doesn't tell one how to handles actions the rules do not cover.Yep, and I stated the rule Thasmodius stated was not in 4e, and that it was a houserule... I don't see how this in anyway goes against what I said. Sure does and it does not state ... "write it down and we'll come up with something if it comes up in the game in a manner in which the results need to be randomly determined." Now, my question is does it handle it in the same way that Thasmodius states above... if not I rest my case.  Does it in fact state if you want a background skill, write it on your sheet and the DM will come up with a system to determine it's effectiveness in gameplay... or does it say hey, here's a way to resolve any ad-hoc action you might want to try that there's no skill for.  There's a subtle difference there.EDIT:  The funny thing is that I have rpg's where it is an actual rule that a PC can have a "specialized" skill they made up that gives them the same advantage (bonus to a roll) as a normal skill, but then if D&D 4e had that as an actual rule... a character might end up unbalanced in gameplay.</blockquote>

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