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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Rushbolt" data-source="post: 9517122" data-attributes="member: 7037578">While originally I did not agree with people stating the Ranger should not be given abilities that are part of the Rogue class, I am starting to come around to it now.  Building a wilderness survival class well absolutely means you need to stay away from abilities like Expertise because including it uses too many of the precious few class feature slots that should be actually used to reinforce the identity of the class.  If the class gives the player all the reasons needed to maximize their WIS score as early as possible the Ranger will stay ahead of the Rogue with Expertise.  It would be more beneficial to take Expertise and any Dexterity-oriented features, including saving throw proficiency, out of the Ranger class.  It would make more sense to lean in to spreading WIS bonuses into other places they don't normally apply. This gives more reason to invest in WIS and just basically maximizes those skills without needing to build in Expertise.  WIS bonuses being applied to non-WIS saves and the Gloom Stalker WIS bonus to initiative just becoming part of the class would be a good start.  Finally, allowing WIS bonus to replace DEX and STR for attack  and possibly damage bonuses on weapon attack rolls would also really go a long way in shoring up the classes multi-ability score dependency issues. I believe that WotC was trying to build the Primeval Awareness spells from Tasha's into the class just by increasing the number of spells the Ranger can prepare, but this did not go over well because they didn't explain that at any point.  I have no idea why that option was not presented in any video or article about the class to explain it.  Alternately, put the Primeval Awareness spells into the Hunter and/or Beast Master class to keep that flavor.  I can make a Beast Master Ranger right now and not be able to cast Speak with Animals or Animal Friendship.  That doesn't even make sense!Finally, a note on Climb and Swim checks when you have a Climb and Swim speed.  I believe a lot of people are thinking of the Spider Climb ability of some monsters and confusing that with just having a Climb speed.  I do play at conventions and rules are run as written more often than not there for consistency.  In organized play the Ranger would absolutely need to make Climb and Swim checks if the adventure called for it.  They would also be very bad at them unless they were more STR-based.  There is nothing in the rules that says having a Climb or Swim speed gives you bonuses to those checks or allows you to forego them.  I'm not a big fan of the way these rules are written and I could definitely see houseruling an adjustment, but the fact remains the feature is written poorly considering the rules actually present in the 2024 PH.</blockquote>

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