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<blockquote data-quote="Celebrim" data-source="post: 8747019" data-attributes="member: 4937">My D&amp;D is the one with fire elementals, ghouls, and giant spiders that can climb as well or better than their tiny brethren.&nbsp; All three of those things violates the laws of physics in this universe, something you brush aside.&nbsp; I'm not the one selectively sensing the D&amp;D universe.&nbsp; I'm not the one that needs to hold my nose and grin nor close my eyes to an issue because I'm not trying to defend the indefensible, that the D&amp;D universe is realistic and runs on the laws of physics except when otherwise specified.&nbsp; It's always otherwise specified.&nbsp; It's not just one or two things.Your D&amp;D is the one where you keep trying to shoehorn the laws of physics into a world that clearly doesn't function by them.&nbsp; What's really interesting is the rationalizations you go through to do that.&nbsp; When I point to the fact that giant spiders can climb walls as proof that they have mundane magic, that is to say they are obeying the laws of physics of the D&amp;D universe, you reject that to the point that you insist in your version of D&amp;D they don't climb walls because it would break physics.&nbsp; You refuse to consider an explanation for the giant spider climbing the wall that suggests the physics of the D&amp;D universe are the mystical rules that magic runs on.Yet with the fire elemental or the ghoul, you are clearly not even attempting to use the laws of physics to explain that while simultaneously claiming that they aren't &quot;magic&quot;. Yet when confronted by a different problem that suggests the laws of physics aren't in play, you feel perfectly free then to suggest a magical solution to the problem that whenever a human falls, they are being cushioned by a god or getting super lucky.&nbsp; Where is your proof that free fall in D&amp;D has never been free fall?&nbsp; Your ad hoc explanation is fine, I have no problem with it, but it directly contradicts the very assertion that you bristled at initially and seem to have forgotten you are defending.&nbsp; Here we have a fighter that has done nothing but physical and non-magical training using magical means to survive falling, something you insisted didn't happen.&nbsp; So how do we know a fighter with nothing but physical training doesn't get similarly lucky or have similar divine aid when he jumps a great distance or strikes the top of a mountain?I can provide a simpler explanation to all of this - the laws of physics as you know them in D&amp;D don't apply to world of dragons, ghouls, fire elementals, and 20th level fighters.&nbsp; The exact laws of physics it conforms to are never explained explicitly but can be reasonably inferred to be the ones believed in by the sort of people that believed earth, fire, water, and air were elements.&nbsp; And if you do infer that, then the entire fantastic world of D&amp;D is explained through that, because the D&amp;D world and fantasy worlds generally run on the conceit &quot;what if the myths are real&quot;.</blockquote>

[QUOTE="Celebrim, post: 8747019, member: 4937"] My D&D is the one with fire elementals, ghouls, and giant spiders that can climb as well or better than their tiny brethren. All three of those things violates the laws of physics in this universe, something you brush aside. I'm not the one selectively sensing the D&D universe. I'm not the one that needs to hold my nose and grin nor close my eyes to an issue because I'm not trying to defend the indefensible, that the D&D universe is realistic and runs on the laws of physics except when otherwise specified. It's always otherwise specified. It's not just one or two things. Your D&D is the one where you keep trying to shoehorn the laws of physics into a world that clearly doesn't function by them. What's really interesting is the rationalizations you go through to do that. When I point to the fact that giant spiders can climb walls as proof that they have mundane magic, that is to say they are obeying the laws of physics of the D&D universe, you reject that to the point that you insist in your version of D&D they don't climb walls because it would break physics. You refuse to consider an explanation for the giant spider climbing the wall that suggests the physics of the D&D universe are the mystical rules that magic runs on. Yet with the fire elemental or the ghoul, you are clearly not even attempting to use the laws of physics to explain that while simultaneously claiming that they aren't "magic". Yet when confronted by a different problem that suggests the laws of physics aren't in play, you feel perfectly free then to suggest a magical solution to the problem that whenever a human falls, they are being cushioned by a god or getting super lucky. Where is your proof that free fall in D&D has never been free fall? Your ad hoc explanation is fine, I have no problem with it, but it directly contradicts the very assertion that you bristled at initially and seem to have forgotten you are defending. Here we have a fighter that has done nothing but physical and non-magical training using magical means to survive falling, something you insisted didn't happen. So how do we know a fighter with nothing but physical training doesn't get similarly lucky or have similar divine aid when he jumps a great distance or strikes the top of a mountain? I can provide a simpler explanation to all of this - the laws of physics as you know them in D&D don't apply to world of dragons, ghouls, fire elementals, and 20th level fighters. The exact laws of physics it conforms to are never explained explicitly but can be reasonably inferred to be the ones believed in by the sort of people that believed earth, fire, water, and air were elements. And if you do infer that, then the entire fantastic world of D&D is explained through that, because the D&D world and fantasy worlds generally run on the conceit "what if the myths are real". [/QUOTE]

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