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<blockquote data-quote="Hussar" data-source="post: 8248487" data-attributes="member: 22779">See, but right there, that's a problem.&nbsp; Number one, we trounced the group that we took prisoners.&nbsp; To the point where we overwhelmed them without taking any damage.&nbsp; So, obviously, we were not pushovers.&nbsp; But, all that does if you treat it as &quot;warning them you're coming&quot; is mean that I would never attempt it again.&nbsp; We'll just frontally assault everything because trying to avoid confrontation obviously won't work.It's extremely frustrating from the player's perspective that every plan will catastrophically fail and no matter what, the DM will interpret the situation in the worst possible manner, and then complain about why players treat dungeons as 90% combat.&nbsp; When the players hand you a plausible (even if it's not particularly great, it's still plausible) plan, let it succeed.&nbsp; Otherwise, the players just turtle up and treat everything as something to be killed. Why bother taking prisoners if every prisoner does nothing but lie, or obfuscate?&nbsp; If it is never better to take prisoners and it is always worse, then, well, don't expect the players to take prisoners.&nbsp; And so many players have been taught that lesson by DM's out there that treat information like it's the most precious of resources, only to be doled out in the most dire of circumstances.&nbsp; One thing about running online games like I do is that I see a lot of new players over the years.&nbsp; And that lesson is one that so many players have learned - that the only real solution to anything is to kill stuff.&nbsp; Otherwise, the DM will simply screw you over and then you have to kill stuff anyway.So, yeah, I totally get why people think that dungeon crawls are nothing but dice fapping hack fests with zero interaction and virtually no role play.&nbsp; They are taught that that's how a dungeon crawl should be by DM's who probably learned from other DM's who treat dungeon crawls that way.</blockquote>

[QUOTE="Hussar, post: 8248487, member: 22779"] See, but right there, that's a problem. Number one, we trounced the group that we took prisoners. To the point where we overwhelmed them without taking any damage. So, obviously, we were not pushovers. But, all that does if you treat it as "warning them you're coming" is mean that I would never attempt it again. We'll just frontally assault everything because trying to avoid confrontation obviously won't work. It's extremely frustrating from the player's perspective that every plan will catastrophically fail and no matter what, the DM will interpret the situation in the worst possible manner, and then complain about why players treat dungeons as 90% combat. When the players hand you a plausible (even if it's not particularly great, it's still plausible) plan, let it succeed. Otherwise, the players just turtle up and treat everything as something to be killed. Why bother taking prisoners if every prisoner does nothing but lie, or obfuscate? If it is never better to take prisoners and it is always worse, then, well, don't expect the players to take prisoners. And so many players have been taught that lesson by DM's out there that treat information like it's the most precious of resources, only to be doled out in the most dire of circumstances. One thing about running online games like I do is that I see a lot of new players over the years. And that lesson is one that so many players have learned - that the only real solution to anything is to kill stuff. Otherwise, the DM will simply screw you over and then you have to kill stuff anyway. So, yeah, I totally get why people think that dungeon crawls are nothing but dice fapping hack fests with zero interaction and virtually no role play. They are taught that that's how a dungeon crawl should be by DM's who probably learned from other DM's who treat dungeon crawls that way. [/QUOTE]

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