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General Tabletop Discussion
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The mathematics of D&D–Damage and HP
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<blockquote data-quote="tetrasodium" data-source="post: 8227637" data-attributes="member: 93670"><p>It's one of the better ways a wizard can do nondamage stuff, but casters have a huge damage gap significant hp gap & generally a notable AC gap so the nondamage stuff needs to bridge the gap & then some to make up for the times they are conserving spell slots or don't have the situationally perfect spell prepped. </p><p></p><p>Frankly there are too many thumbs on the scale for that to happen as combined they add up to an overwhelming combo</p><ul> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Magic weapon of any kind ignores resist to nonmagical bps while energy resist is hugely overused but never goes away. This is bad enough that you almost immediately after Tasha's saw folks post order of scribes spell guides that list all the b/p/s spells & spells that go from rarely useful to great when they do things like switch from poison to bludgeoning damage.</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Concentration is overused on spells so for example web banish magic weapon & enlarge are all some level of ok to good spells but only one can be used as <em>all</em> of them are concentration</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Magic resist to give advantage against saves is overused while monsters with difficult to hit ACs are less than common.</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Feats exist to specialize for weapon damage (ie GWM & such) or defense (ie medium/heavy armor master) while very little specialization & synergy can be obtained through feats for casters with web+telekinetic get back in there one of the very few exceptions </li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">A huge number of spells generally fall under the "almost good" or "unused by design" labels, often due to excessive saves, secondary ways out, or range/aoe coverage that got shrunk to something that really kinda requires the GM to set the stage by putting all the baddies close together. Web is a good example of an ok to good spell that could have been great. Compare 3.5 & 5e web<br /> [spoiler]<br /> [ATTACH=full]134477[/ATTACH]<br /> [ATTACH=full]134478[/ATTACH]<br /> [ATTACH=full]134475[/ATTACH]<br /> [ATTACH=full]134476[/ATTACH]<br /> [/spoiler]<ul> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">10min per level to 1hr. This part is a wash since caster level 6 is nothing & will exceed it from 7th on but it's almost never going to be needed </li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">Reflex negates to dex negates is the same</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">No saves each round to strength save each round</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">DC20 strength check or DC25 escape artist check to dc=caster's spell save DC each round is a <em>huge</em> nerf that more than consumes the hit from move 5 feet for every 5 points you beat dc10 by since realistically caster dc is never going to be 20-25 in 5e.</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">20foot radius to a 20foot cube?... that's about half the aoe coverage</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">100ft+10ft/caster level to 60 ft?... That's a gigantic drop in range & especially notable given the insane range bump on ranged weapons.</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">spell resistance:no to magic resist grants advantage on the save.... There don't even exist spells to bypass magic resistance in 5e, this is a gigantic nerf.</li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">fire & forget to concentration so your web might drop if you get his & even if that's not an issue you now can't cast web with most other buff/debuff/DoT/Area Denial spells like haste curse magic weapon elemental weapon enlarge wall of whatever(fire/ice/etc) & many more despite many of those spells themselves also getting a similar set of petty nerfs</li> </ul></li> <li data-xf-list-type="ul">That concentration cherry on top of all the other petty nerfs & hinderances adds up to ensure the caster never uses them in conjunction to go from doing something to occasionally really stepping out from being the squishy character with mediocre damage into the spotlight as more than "well I guess that was a useful speedbump" or "I guess that helped a little"</li> </ul></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="tetrasodium, post: 8227637, member: 93670"] It's one of the better ways a wizard can do nondamage stuff, but casters have a huge damage gap significant hp gap & generally a notable AC gap so the nondamage stuff needs to bridge the gap & then some to make up for the times they are conserving spell slots or don't have the situationally perfect spell prepped. Frankly there are too many thumbs on the scale for that to happen as combined they add up to an overwhelming combo [LIST] [*]Magic weapon of any kind ignores resist to nonmagical bps while energy resist is hugely overused but never goes away. This is bad enough that you almost immediately after Tasha's saw folks post order of scribes spell guides that list all the b/p/s spells & spells that go from rarely useful to great when they do things like switch from poison to bludgeoning damage. [*]Concentration is overused on spells so for example web banish magic weapon & enlarge are all some level of ok to good spells but only one can be used as [I]all[/I] of them are concentration [*]Magic resist to give advantage against saves is overused while monsters with difficult to hit ACs are less than common. [*]Feats exist to specialize for weapon damage (ie GWM & such) or defense (ie medium/heavy armor master) while very little specialization & synergy can be obtained through feats for casters with web+telekinetic get back in there one of the very few exceptions [*]A huge number of spells generally fall under the "almost good" or "unused by design" labels, often due to excessive saves, secondary ways out, or range/aoe coverage that got shrunk to something that really kinda requires the GM to set the stage by putting all the baddies close together. Web is a good example of an ok to good spell that could have been great. Compare 3.5 & 5e web [spoiler] [ATTACH type="full"]134477[/ATTACH] [ATTACH type="full"]134478[/ATTACH] [ATTACH type="full"]134475[/ATTACH] [ATTACH type="full"]134476[/ATTACH] [/spoiler] [LIST] [*]10min per level to 1hr. This part is a wash since caster level 6 is nothing & will exceed it from 7th on but it's almost never going to be needed [*]Reflex negates to dex negates is the same [*]No saves each round to strength save each round [*]DC20 strength check or DC25 escape artist check to dc=caster's spell save DC each round is a [I]huge[/I] nerf that more than consumes the hit from move 5 feet for every 5 points you beat dc10 by since realistically caster dc is never going to be 20-25 in 5e. [*]20foot radius to a 20foot cube?... that's about half the aoe coverage [*]100ft+10ft/caster level to 60 ft?... That's a gigantic drop in range & especially notable given the insane range bump on ranged weapons. [*]spell resistance:no to magic resist grants advantage on the save.... There don't even exist spells to bypass magic resistance in 5e, this is a gigantic nerf. [*]fire & forget to concentration so your web might drop if you get his & even if that's not an issue you now can't cast web with most other buff/debuff/DoT/Area Denial spells like haste curse magic weapon elemental weapon enlarge wall of whatever(fire/ice/etc) & many more despite many of those spells themselves also getting a similar set of petty nerfs [/LIST] [*]That concentration cherry on top of all the other petty nerfs & hinderances adds up to ensure the caster never uses them in conjunction to go from doing something to occasionally really stepping out from being the squishy character with mediocre damage into the spotlight as more than "well I guess that was a useful speedbump" or "I guess that helped a little" [/LIST] [/QUOTE]
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