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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Kahuna Burger" data-source="post: 1415006" data-attributes="member: 8439">Are you aware of any historical cases where Adolf hitler killed an underling himself, in cold blood, on any issue, much less a gratuitous one? Aside from his wife and himself, I don't know of any killing Hitler did with his own hands after leaving the army. If you say it 'never stopped them' I hope you can demonstrate that each one actually did it more than once.As for 'real' pure evil, serial killers are boring. While they may be gratuitously evil, they make bad villains for other reasons, and cannot be the BBEG because their lack of stability tends to prevent the aquisition of followers. The various dictators and such, while not always 'grey' tend to have evil of another non gratuitous sort - the 'cold' variety. Little up close and personal death, little attachment to the suffering, just doing business. When writers try to have an evil as calculating as a successful dictator, but as debased as a serial killer, thats where I find it becomes gratuitous and silly. How 'bout the big bad in The Crow? "I kill women in kinky group sex with my sister the witch, stab people for fun and have an incredibly powerful organization based on doing evil, and I'm anoyed that we've strayed away from doing chaotic stupid things in favor of making the organization sustainable... did i meantion the kinky sex with my sister, done mostly for the evil Athurian overtones?"For over the top evil in a well leashed underling (where it makes more sense) I'd say caleb in the final buffy season. As if his intro wasn't enough, the bit where he's having the First take on the forms of his old victims so he can relive his favorite misogynistic slayings was just the reminder we needed that this guy has no plan, no class, just another psycho on a leash. kahuna Burger</blockquote>

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