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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Shemeska" data-source="post: 4555424" data-attributes="member: 11697">Without resorting to treating them like end-level boss monsters at the end of a planar dungeon. And if they really truly want a PCs vs Deity roll for initiative style fight, make the stats to fit their needs, because at that end of things, the numerical stats tend to be an absolutely ludicrous block of numbers that you might as well make them up arbitrarily for your game.Full blown deity stats are a waste of page space IMO (and I really do adore Erik Mona's comments on deity stat blocks after he had to write a ton of them for 3.x FR's Faiths&Pantheons) because they set as standard the idea of using such beings as even bigger monsters, rather than as anything more fantastic and removed from the mundane world of human vs orc, etc.Avatars can have their uses certainly, but for actual conflict with a god, you can avoid the grossly mundane standup fight with the always fun use of artifacts and such Macguffins, playing the tricky game of planar politics and pitting gods against one another, or dragging planar lords like archfiends into the mix if you really want to get your hands dirty.I've had deicide in my games before, but never once has a PC rolled to hit Thor with a +35 axe of overkill or anything similar. It's just not a playstyle I care for, and certainly one that makes me sigh to see implicitly promoted in 4e. As much grief as I've been prone to give WotC, I'd like to see them make a damn good planar book because it promotes the sub-genre of gaming that's my personal favorite. But if they're giving deity stats for PCs to fight, that's a step towards a vision of planar beings that's just about anathema to my own.More coherent and possibly less unintentionally offense comments on this later tonight. At work, typing in between things as I can.</blockquote>

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