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<blockquote data-quote="(Psi)SeveredHead" data-source="post: 2968619" data-attributes="member: 1165">You can't surprise it if you didn't see it first. Who is likely to be surprised, you or the creature that can change its appearance? How do you know it's coming? How do you know it's hostile?Is melee not valid? Wow, that fencer concept gets trashed.Without metagaming, you don't know its abilities. Even if you make your Knowledge check, it has a wide range of abilities, so you might not know it can cast Cone of Cold. (And it can move up on you invisible and then blast you with a Cone of Cold.)Ditto.That always happens.So if your party has a rogue, they're not allowed to go near it? Wow, that sounds like a lot of fun.A monster is supposed to be easy for an equal CR fight, regardless of how it's defeated. I would give the PCs bonus XP if they beat it &quot;smart&quot;, though. This is in addition to other advantages (eg taking less damage, using up less healing, etc).If your players never use cool tactics, this is a problem with the players and DMs, not a problem with the monster.Isn't that called a mage? I think an ogre mage should be tougher than that. Otherwise, why bother making it an ogre?</blockquote>

[QUOTE="(Psi)SeveredHead, post: 2968619, member: 1165"] You can't surprise it if you didn't see it first. Who is likely to be surprised, you or the creature that can change its appearance? How do you know it's coming? How do you know it's hostile? Is melee not valid? Wow, that fencer concept gets trashed. Without metagaming, you don't know its abilities. Even if you make your Knowledge check, it has a wide range of abilities, so you might not know it can cast Cone of Cold. (And it can move up on you invisible and then blast you with a Cone of Cold.) Ditto. That always happens. So if your party has a rogue, they're not allowed to go near it? Wow, that sounds like a lot of fun. A monster is supposed to be [i]easy[/i] for an equal CR fight, regardless of how it's defeated. I would give the PCs bonus XP if they beat it "smart", though. This is in addition to other advantages (eg taking less damage, using up less healing, etc). If your players never use cool tactics, this is a problem with the players and DMs, not a problem with the monster. Isn't that called a mage? I think an [b]ogre[/b] mage should be tougher than that. Otherwise, why bother making it an ogre? [/QUOTE]

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