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General Tabletop Discussion
Character Builds & Optimization
'The Paladin as King': Cutting Through the Hype
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<blockquote data-quote="FormerlyHemlock" data-source="post: 6756036" data-attributes="member: 6787650"><p>Okay, I'm on phone so short shrift, but the biggest surprise to me is how good the Paladin has been. The original party was a three-man ranged party with high mobility, and I figured the tank-focused Paladin would just hold the front line occasionally when kiting wasn't feasible, in close terrain--but he's actually been an all-star who makes kiting almost superfluous because he NEVER GETS HURT.</p><p></p><p>Level progression was Paladin of Devotion 1 to 6 for Aura and Find Steed, then Sorcerer 1 to 3 for Shield and Metamagic, then I don't remember what order P7 and S4 came in. Lucky feat initially, then Cha boosting with ASIs because his original primary job is protection. P7 makes Hypnotic Pattern usable without friendly fire problems.</p><p></p><p>If I did it again I would take Sorcerer 1 earlier for Shield because it, combined with Dodging, was transformative.</p><p></p><p>I originally intended Dragon Sorcerer but took Wild instead for the sake of Bend Luck later, because he's a protector and I decided that that was more vital than a marginally Fire Bolt/Fireball. Tides of Chaos is probably nice but so far it actually has never been needed, though it got used a couple of times for fun just to make surges happen in combat, in hopes of an AoE surge like Fireball, to see what would happen. So far the only memorable Wild Surge has been de-aging himself back into beardless youth, age 17, which has made him philosophical about bodies and aging. "It's just a mask, it's not who you really are."</p><p></p><p>Also if I did it again I would take Warcaster as bonus feat instead of Lucky, for several reasons: there aren't as many close calls with saves or crits as I expected, and it's possible he has yet to even spend any luck dice; Warcaster synergizes really well with grapple+prone (especially of a Hexed target) so you can still Shield, which has been a major trade-off so far with grappling; SCAG's cantrips make Warcaster very attractive for a tank trying to disincentivize enemies from bypassing him; and it would be nice to be able to toss up Quickened Blur or Shield of Faith with absolutely no concerns over losing concentration. Win-win-win.</p><p></p><p>When your enemy has disadvantage from prone or Dodge or Blur, even the threat of AC 26 via Shield goes a long, long way. (Full plate, shield, defense style.) Usually it isn't even actually needed--and Warcaster prevents you from being easily bypassed while Dodging, because while d8+3 is not a lot of damage for an opportunity attack, 3d8+3 is quite respectable, especially with another 3d8 ready to hit as soon as you move another foot. Better to abort and go back to attacking the Paladin, disadvantage or not, or just flee from the PCs.</p><p></p><p>Oh, and Warcaster lets you Shield Bash a grappled, prone enemy at advantage but no proficiency with Greenflame Blade for 2d8+d4+3 damage, plus maybe hitting someone else for more, instead of the two attacks for 2d4+6 you'd get otherwise.</p><p></p><p>So, Warcaster is great for a paladorc who wants to tank while ranged PCs do damage.</p><p></p><p>He has a warhorse Steed named Claudius who tends not to feature in combat scenarios because a scenario where steeds are suitable tends also to be trivializable via kiting, so gets skipped over. But a large mount does let you physically block the movement of Huge creatures, which can be nice if you're trying to tank Fire Giants or something. So far that's never been needed but it's in the back of my mind, and I intend to pick up Mounted Combatant eventually, as my fourth and last ASI at level 18 or 19.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="FormerlyHemlock, post: 6756036, member: 6787650"] Okay, I'm on phone so short shrift, but the biggest surprise to me is how good the Paladin has been. The original party was a three-man ranged party with high mobility, and I figured the tank-focused Paladin would just hold the front line occasionally when kiting wasn't feasible, in close terrain--but he's actually been an all-star who makes kiting almost superfluous because he NEVER GETS HURT. Level progression was Paladin of Devotion 1 to 6 for Aura and Find Steed, then Sorcerer 1 to 3 for Shield and Metamagic, then I don't remember what order P7 and S4 came in. Lucky feat initially, then Cha boosting with ASIs because his original primary job is protection. P7 makes Hypnotic Pattern usable without friendly fire problems. If I did it again I would take Sorcerer 1 earlier for Shield because it, combined with Dodging, was transformative. I originally intended Dragon Sorcerer but took Wild instead for the sake of Bend Luck later, because he's a protector and I decided that that was more vital than a marginally Fire Bolt/Fireball. Tides of Chaos is probably nice but so far it actually has never been needed, though it got used a couple of times for fun just to make surges happen in combat, in hopes of an AoE surge like Fireball, to see what would happen. So far the only memorable Wild Surge has been de-aging himself back into beardless youth, age 17, which has made him philosophical about bodies and aging. "It's just a mask, it's not who you really are." Also if I did it again I would take Warcaster as bonus feat instead of Lucky, for several reasons: there aren't as many close calls with saves or crits as I expected, and it's possible he has yet to even spend any luck dice; Warcaster synergizes really well with grapple+prone (especially of a Hexed target) so you can still Shield, which has been a major trade-off so far with grappling; SCAG's cantrips make Warcaster very attractive for a tank trying to disincentivize enemies from bypassing him; and it would be nice to be able to toss up Quickened Blur or Shield of Faith with absolutely no concerns over losing concentration. Win-win-win. When your enemy has disadvantage from prone or Dodge or Blur, even the threat of AC 26 via Shield goes a long, long way. (Full plate, shield, defense style.) Usually it isn't even actually needed--and Warcaster prevents you from being easily bypassed while Dodging, because while d8+3 is not a lot of damage for an opportunity attack, 3d8+3 is quite respectable, especially with another 3d8 ready to hit as soon as you move another foot. Better to abort and go back to attacking the Paladin, disadvantage or not, or just flee from the PCs. Oh, and Warcaster lets you Shield Bash a grappled, prone enemy at advantage but no proficiency with Greenflame Blade for 2d8+d4+3 damage, plus maybe hitting someone else for more, instead of the two attacks for 2d4+6 you'd get otherwise. So, Warcaster is great for a paladorc who wants to tank while ranged PCs do damage. He has a warhorse Steed named Claudius who tends not to feature in combat scenarios because a scenario where steeds are suitable tends also to be trivializable via kiting, so gets skipped over. But a large mount does let you physically block the movement of Huge creatures, which can be nice if you're trying to tank Fire Giants or something. So far that's never been needed but it's in the back of my mind, and I intend to pick up Mounted Combatant eventually, as my fourth and last ASI at level 18 or 19. [/QUOTE]
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